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ARE THE IRISH BISHOPS ENCOURAGING PEOPLE TO BREAK THE LAW AND COMMIT OFFENCES?

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The Irish Catholic bishops, in a statement following their Winter General Meeting in Maynooth, said they were dismayed that, for the most part, the voices of those who voted against abortion in May’s referendum have been ignored.
They highlighted how “reasonable” proposals for legislative amendments to the bill, such as the prohibition of abortion on the grounds of sex, race or disability, had been rejected.
The bishops also expressed concern over the bill’s erosion of the right of conscientious objection for all healthcare professionals and pharmacists. “They cannot be forced either to participate in abortion or to refer patients to others for abortion,” they warned.

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Separately, Bishop Kevin Doran has called on doctors, nurses, teachers and pharmaceutical workers to “resist” the new abortion regime.
Bishop Kevin Doran said the Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy Bill had no moral force and ought to be resisted. “Catholics have no obligation whatsoever to obey this law,” he told the Irish Independent.
He said the bishops “absolutely support the right of doctors and nurses and midwives, not only not to perform abortions, but not to be required under the law to refer their patients”, even though this will bring them into conflict with the law.
His view was echoed by former Taoiseach, John Bruton, who warned that no person, medically qualified or otherwise, should be forced by the threat to his/her employment, or of criminal sanctions, to be involved in the ending of a human life, against his or her religious convictions.
In a speech delivered at the Irish Catholic Doctors’ Learning Network Annual Conference in Swords, Co Dublin, last weekend, Mr Bruton said a law that forces someone to take part in, or to facilitate, an action that that person believes is contrary to a deeply held religious conviction could be in conflict with Article 44.2.1 of the Irish Constitution.
“That aspect of the Bill should be changed. The concept of ‘aiding and abetting’ a crime is well understood in Irish law. The Bill requires a doctor, who has a conscientious objection to doing an abortion herself, to “make arrangements to transfer the care” of the woman to a doctor who will do it. This could certainly be construed as aiding and abetting the abortion, and there is no conscience clause here either.”
Under the terms of the legislation, medical professionals who fail to make the referral will be deemed to be committing a criminal offence.

PAT SAYS:

The Irish people have spoken about the abortion issue and the Irish Government must put that vote into legislation.

Amy Martin of Armagh says that no one is listening to those who lost the vote! Amy must have being off school the day that his classmates studied civics and politics – where they would have learned that the voices who are listened to in a vote are the MAJORITY of those who voted.

I am not pro abortion – far from it!

But I cannot force my religious views and my denominational outlook on all my fellow citizens.

THE CATHOLIC DOCTORS:

There are a group of RC doctors and medical professionals who are whinging that they cannot be enforced to put Irish law into effect because of their RC conscience.

If they are prepared to take Euro 120,000 plus from a state that allows abortions they should do what their employer tells them to do.

Or – if they do not like their job description – let them have the authenticity to resign and get a job elsewhere!

If they refuse to carry out their employer’s job description – let them simply be sacked! 

CHURCH ENCOURAGING PEOPLE TO BREAK THE LAW:

Could Eamon Martin and Kevin Doran be breaking the law by encouraging people to resist the law?

If they are – the authorities should act against them.

And if there are no laws on the statute book to deal with this – bring in new laws.

The Irish Catholic bishops have ruled and tyrannised this country for hundreds of years.

The Irish Government should protect its citizens from this tyranny.

The Irish bishops are, and have been, moral and social terrorists!

pope benedicts 2 commandments


 

ANOTHER RC BISHOP – CORRUPTION AND SEX

INDIAN BISHOP STOLE CHURCH MONEY TO BUY HIS CONCUBINE AND THEIR SON VARIOUS PROPERTIES.

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Pope Francis accepted on December 10 the resignation of Cuddapah Bishop Prasad Gallela, 56, South East India.

Two Catholics had filed a criminal complaint against him in a court in Andhra Pradesh. One of them, Mesa Ravi Kumar, 40, alleged that Gallela used funds from overseas donations and money meant for public welfare to buy properties for his concubine and a 20-year-old son who is now in college.

Kumar showed 24 documents such as a 12-digit unique identification number identifying Gallela as the husband of his alleged wife.

According to priests of the diocese, Gallela used to spend less than a week a month at the bishop’s house. Nobody knew where he was during the rest of the time. Gallela said the woman was his late brother’s widow.

In April 2016 Gallela was kidnapped and beaten by some of his own priests, and released after a ransom was paid.

56 replies on “ARE THE IRISH BISHOPS ENCOURAGING PEOPLE TO BREAK THE LAW AND COMMIT OFFENCES?”

Buckley, you don’t care a toss for God’s laws or unjust State laws. As long as you can in some way harpoon the Church of Christ, it is all just grist to your ghoulish mill. You are an evil, twisted perverted human being.

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Pat, abortion, the deliberate killing/destruction of the unborn child is not just a religious/faith matter. It is a human rights issue. As such it is also an ethical and moral issue. Many non religious people disapprove of it. You cannot equivocate on the true meaning of the word. Let’s not devalue completely the sanctity of unborn babies and their inalienable right to life. I couldn’t care about your beliefs – you blow with the wind. The Bishops are not the only group in society who believe that abortion is morally repugnant. You, Buckley, compromise you supposed beliefs, values and principles simply to seem to be “relevant” and “modern”. You have abandoned many moral truths. Because a law has been voted by the majority does not necessarily make it right, as in the case of abortion, which is the deliberate killing of the unborn child. We will, in a short time, recognise the monstrosity of the industry of abortion, which is evident in countries with a stricter abortion regime that ours.

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Personally I am anti abortion except in rare, sad cases.
However, we have had enough of the bishops trying to rule Ireland.

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Patsy at 9:59am
Patsy no one should be forced to have to take part in what they consider murder no matter what law is imposed on them by any civil authority. You should be supporting the Hierarchy in this regard.
Evviva Maria!

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I am firmly with the Roman Catholic Irish bishops on this one, despite the fact that I absolutely despise them as priest-parasites and morally corrupt.
Would I, as a family doctor, assist someone to procure an abortion? Please God, through your grace, never.
Would I, as a family doctor, refer a patient to another doctor willing to help procure an abortion? Please God, through your grace, never.
When we willingly kill the very young and defenceless, we shal kill anyone else, if circumstance requires it, or renders it convenient.
The worth of ANY human life is measured and weighed by how much we care for those naturally least valued.

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Mad Magna Caca at 12:51
Polly normally as you know I despise you as morally corrupt and an anti-Catholic,anti clerical bigot. But I am with you on this, a very good comment apart from the first paragraph. There is some hope for you.
Love and prayers B.
Evviva Maria!

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This is ridiculous. Health professionals have the option to work in another field of care if they don’t want to refer for abortions. Elderly care, for example. If they had a personal objection to any other procedure this is what they would do and it wouldn’t be in the papers.

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Dear Pat,
Your thinking behind today’s blog required some challenge. You presume a conscientious object to abortion is a religioys ground. It is not, or at least not necessarily. I do not agree with abortion and that has nothing to do with my religious beliefs.
There is no right to abortion; what we voted on was to remove the unborn’s right to life. Nothing more, nothing less. This bill debates how abortion may happen now that it is de-criminalised and considered optional “healthcare”. [Medically required abortion was already legal]. Should every dentist be required to undertake referrals for root canals, which are more necessary than optional abortion? Not all healthcare is equal I guess.
If a person wants an abortion they will get a DR to refer them. If a particular GP doesnt want to be involved leave them opt out. It is perfectly reasonable for a GP to be uneasy about later mental or physical health effects to the mother. This has nothing to do with religion.
As for your comment on sacking people – you of all people know the effects of this. In Ireland we have a constitutional right to earn a living (we do not have a constitutional right to access abortions as a matter of choice). Ergo, without an option to conscientiously object the resultant Act may well be challenged and cast out by the courts as unconstitutional. Where will that leave the women seeking their abortions except in the labour wards.

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8.08: Well articulated, alongside other reasoned, thoughtful comments. Wouldn’t it be such a change if Pat had as clear a moral mind about abortion and it’s intended, awful consequences? Sadly, in being seen to be “more compassionate” and “different” to the rest of us, he compromises deeply held moral views about the sanctity of the unborn child. The suggestion that conscientious objectors should be sacked or receive lesser pay than the death merchants of abortion is a morally defunct argument.

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Hi but The church will never win by control. Ireland fought for freedom. Church needs to lead by prayer and compassion and not manipulation

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Pat, since we are now being asked to accept a progressive abortion regime where unborn children will be destroyed/killed, it is the duty of all of us, Bishops included, to speak against such proposals. This abortion regime will be the most progressive of any country in Europe. If doctors, nurses and any other medical staff have profound conscientious (moral and etethical) objections, they must be respected. Your suggestion that they should receive a reduced pay packet or be dismissed is outlandish. We are dealing with unborn human life and we who are Catholic have a supreme responsibility to uphold the sanctity, preciousness and unique gift of every unborn child, the most fragile and vulnerable members of the human family. The Bishops are right to challenge this bill and its awful, dark consequences.

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We are all bound to abide by the laws of our country, especially when we live in a democracy and a majority have voted for a law. I am anti abortion except in rare cases.

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If protecting the life of the unborn child by speaking against the progressive, liberal regime of abortion and requesting conscientious objectors to refuse to participate in abortion, is tyranny, I support that. We got lots of horrible tyranny and misinformation from the repeal side – so it’s morally imperative for the Bishops to define clearly its teachings about the sanctity of the unborn child. This Bill as passed has no place, sadly, for compassion for the unborn child. While I accept that an unborn child may die as a result of necessary medical intervention for the mother, the reality of abortion as a health choice is so contradictory and morally reprehensible. A society that truly cares for and cherishes all, especially the vulnerable unborn child, must not casually allow itself to drift into an abortion on demand society.

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Many Christians have been martyred for less than approving of abortion which is a profoundly evil concept.
And how does Sinn Fein demand that its members vote in favour of abortion? And how does the Irish government demand that even doctors cannot follow a God given conscience?
Conscience is our ultimate guide. I am grateful that there is at least one Sinn Fein member and thankfully many doctors who are people of integrity.
Has Ireland now – government at least – become totally pagan?

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The thing that the RC Church has got right (and it is perhaps the only thing that I agree with them) is the moral and ethical issue about the sanctity of life, from the womb to the grave. I will come back to this.
However, so toxic is the reputation of the RC Church, especially in Ireland, that the bishops will simply not be heard anymore. There is too much damaging baggage that they carry from other issues that people will simply not be led by or even listen to the bishops of the RC Church. They are thoroughly discredited, and should place themselves hors combat until such time as they have the moral credibility to speak.
In the meantime, it is for others to pick up the issue of the protection of and sanctity of human life. I am not worried where they come from, so long as they have at the heart of their argument the sanctity of life in all its forms.
As to the issue in Ireland in respect of medical professionals and their response to the proposed legislation, any wise government would make provision for conscience clauses in this matter, which are effective and provide protection for conscientious action. Trying to force people to act against their conscience is unethical and smacks of intolerance, authoritarianism and totalitarianism.
As a compromise way forward, perhaps the conscience clause could apply to direct action in the procurement of abortion for those who have a conscientious objection. But, if someone presents with a request for abortion, and a medical professional feels that in conscience they cannot act directly, then they should at the least be able and willing to direct that person to someone who will, according to the law, provide them with the service. I know that some people will scream about this also being a direct action in support of abortion, but we have to live in the real world and recognise that in this, as in all matters, there is need for practical compromise, and this small compromise would still provide them with the preservation of their bigger concern, which is direct involvement.
Abortion is a many faceted and complicated phenomenon with very human as well as moral and ethical aspects to it, and while I do support the view that says that abortion of an unborn child is always objectively a moral failure, at the same time there will be occasions when the need for abortion is the least moral failure in a particular human situation. All moral situations required careful and considered decisions, and are rarely black and white, completely right or wrong. That is the buggeration of life, unfortunately !
I do not think that it serves any practical or useful purpose for people in these kinds of arguments to dig themselves in so absolutely that there is no room for movement or practical compromise. Medical professionals who do so are being a bit precious and unrealistic. It is not unreasonable for them to consider that they are employees of the State and paid generously by the State. If their conscience is so immovable on this matter that they cannot act within the law, then the impetus of their conscience should lead them to leave and go elsewhere. That would be a conscientious and courageous thing to do. However, Governments that make some reasonable provision for conscience impossible are acting in an authoritarian and dictatorial way. Both sides need to make room for the other.

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11.12: Thank God for PRO LIFE ZEALOTS – we have too many pro abortion zealots who are promoting the destruction of the life of an unborn child. Simple as. These zealots who scream with shrill voices against the sanctity of human life need to reflect deeply.

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Thank you, Magna. Pat, you might be acting too much out of your hurt and pain on this issue. The bishops, miserable as they seem, are doing the right thing here. The remnant need support, not further domineering by a majority. There may very well be issues where clergymen need to be brought under compliance but the child in the womb needs protection. The majority of Irish politicians just voted overwhelmingly not to give medical attention to a baby born alive during an abortion. Majorities can act in an evil way also.

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10.37 you are compromising now. Killing babies is for the politicians and their supporters. Let them publish their own list of abortion doctors. This sponsored killing has yet to come home to roost.

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This is really simple. Choose between your religion and keeping the law. It is no different to any conflict of principle. If the company I work for started to provide weapons to certain regimes, I might have to decide between my principles and my job.

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Interesting so far here ????????
Not one poster refers to the pregnant woman……….what does that say about your posts?

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Buckley, for someone who claims to be against abortion you sure have a funny way of showing it. Again, your own spite and prejudice jaundices everything.

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@12:31 – The pregnant woman has no right whatsoever to deliberately kill her unborn child. Is that clear enough for you?
The child is a separate human being. The child is not “part of her body”. Her “choice” ends at the moment of conception when another human being’s rights and wellbeing has to be considered.
What has happened in Ireland is absolutely monstrous. Abortion is not “healthcare”. It is the absolute opposite of healthcare.
The child’s rights are not conferred by the State. The child has rights by virtue of his/her humanity. No referendum has the authority to remove them. What the abortion referendum has done is legalise slaughter. It is truly horrific and profoundly evil.

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@12.58 Ireland is now a modern forward thinking society. The Church cannot pontificate no longer after the abuse scandals. Abortion and Euthanasia should be legal and you have no right trying to force your outdated views on anyone. Ireland is moving with the times and perhaps you shpuld try moving with it. The days of moralizing and fear are well and truly gone.

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2.24: When yiu know the true meaning if abortion and the methids of abirtion, you’ll find that it’s anot abiut women’s geakth or choice, but the deliberate destruction of an unborn child. Yes, there are circumstances where treatment required by a mother is paramount and end in the death of her unborn did. That is a very different scenario where the shrill, cheering voices jumped up and down on the passing of repeal the 8th, delighted that any unborn child, for whatever reason, can now be destroyed, killed or sacrificed. Why? We’re a modern, secular stare where every moral boundary, in this instance, the deliberate killing of an unborn child, is no longer sacrosanct. The sad truth is that there is now no legal, constitutional protection for the unborn child. Is that progress? Protection the unborn child goes way beyond a religious belief. Protecting UNBORN LIFE is a noble and sacred act.

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What the ……….????………… Do bishops know about the female body?
the female anatomy?
When they speak about abortion do they even know that they are talking about a woman’s body..mind…thinking..their well-being….misogyny MISOGYNY.
Their past behaviour toward pregnant unmarried young females was abhorrent to say the least.
Not to mention their overall care of young children…their altar servers…their seminarian maturing teens.

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I agree with you in some respects, 12:42.
The Irish Roman Catholic Church has a largely and deeply unchristian record when it comes to its historical treatment of unmarried pregnant women and their babies. It judged these women to be the worst sinners and held them in supreme contempt, to be hidden away as a shameful embarrassment and to be treated as the moral trailer-trash it undoubtedly believed them to be.
There is something deeply hypocritical and, frankly, nauseating about the Irish Catholic hierarchy’s new-found concern for the welfare of unborn babies. Is the concern genuine? Or is yet another attempt to claw back ever-ebbing political hegemony?
If these men had truly acted as Christ commanded (as servants) and had sought to persuade people, rather than impose morality upon them through public warnings of grave obligation to comply (and the implicit threat of eschatological punishment for disobedience), they would not be loathed, as they understandably are today.
Neverthelss, as much as I despise the record of the Irish Catholic Church on these tragic human matters, I cannot break ranks with them in defence of unborn life.

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12.42: Not an intelligent reply. Stupid argument. Abortion is about the killing/destruction of the unborn child. That is truth. Except in the gravest of circumstances where a mother’s health or life is endangered, abortion as a means of getting rid of a child is reckless, immoral and repugnant to all civilised human beings. Surely the protection of the most vulnerable – unborn child – is paramount in human rights? Let’s not camouflage the reality and awfulness of abortion by soft words like “women’s right to choose”.!

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1.23 when you resort to commenting on a poster’s intelligence and referring to his/ her post as stupid
You have already lost the argument.

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12.58
Calm down…breathe…
Looks like we have one of those excitable persons who verbally attacked the women assessing health clinics

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“Health clinics”? You abortionists sure love your euphemisms don’t you? Aborttoirs are not health clinics. They are slaughter houses where children are butchered.

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1 45: Health clinics == house of horrors where unborn babies will be killed, deliberately so, mostly for inconvenience. Absolutely. All we need do is look at the facts, truth and horror in Britain.

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I totally disagree with the destruction of the unborn and whilst I despise the RC institution, I would support them in this matter. However, as a man, it is not for me to impose my will on any woman. Only God knows what they are going through when they decide on an abortion. This debate raises an important issue though. The separation of Church and state. The Church have ruled the state for far too long. Now that Ireland is a more secular country it is vital that we (a) obey the laws of the state and (b) use our democratic franchise to elect those candidates who we think will best represent our values. The RC church do not have a democratic mandate to decide our laws. For decades they misused their influence to decide how we lived. We may not like or agree with the laws of our secular society but we must, as democrats, accept them. That having been said, I pray for every woman who finds herself in a situation where she contemplates abortion.

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1.58 that’s a cop out. Standing up for human rights is little to do with church. It’s about basic civilisation. Abortion is only a step. What do you think is next?

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@2.31pm Emotional and over the top clap trap. You sound very Christian indeed, more like a right wing fundamentalist imbalanced fruit cake nutter.

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5.14: Try and express your values and principles, if you have any, rather than pour out your hatred, abortionist that you are!

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Don’t you just love these screaming pro life holy Mary’s. Shouting and preaching and pushing morality down our throats. Nobody gives a shit what Bishops say anymore, don’t you get that? The younger generation want a more secular Ireland that’s progressive in every way. Gay marriage, divorce, women’s rights and their right to choose, assisted dying?, separation of Church and State, throw all bishops and priests and nuns who cover up in Mountjoy. While they are at it, ban all intimidating pro life marches and throw those who attend into the neatest asylum. It’s time Ireland woke up and got with it. Get the Church to hand over it’s assets to the State also. Down with the whole rotten lot of them.

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5.25: Vitriolic hatred. Nothing modern or progressive about the deliberate killing of an unborn human being. You obviously have been deaf at the mob lynch screamers of the abortion brigade who are vicious, nasty and morally blind. Young people have, sadly, bought into the concept of the “have what you want” mentality, irrespective of consequences. In years to come we’ll regret our moral bankruptcy in relation to the sanctity and dignity of human life.

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I’m with the bishops on this one Pat abortion is killing babies no one should be forced to do that. If I was a health professional my attitude to this would be F##k the law.

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Women have the right to choose what they do with their own bodies, They should choose to keep their legs closed. When a life in conceived it’s no longer about their own body only. It’s maddening to hear the tripe about abortion as a womens health issue. What about the health of the baby in utero?
Simon Harris is a little shit….all gung-ho to bring in abortion ASAP, pity he’s not so intention on getting people off trollies and waiting lists.

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Your attitude to women is appalling.
If you think so little of these mothers, then you cannot think much of their unborn children.
Had you been in Palestine 2000 years ago and aware of Mary’s extra-marital pregnancy, you’d have been demanding her stoning, in accordance with the Law, all the while screaming:
‘You should have kept your legs shut!’

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2:58. Its is not a cop out. I have made it crystal clear that I personally do not agree with abortion. I think it is wrong. I hope this clarifies my post earlier. However I was making the point that we are not governed by the RC church in any manner. Thank God

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