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AUSTRALIAN CATHOLIC WANT TOTAL CHURCH REFORM.

Contents

Foreword 1

Preface 7
Recommendations 11

Part 1: God’s mission, the Kingdom of God, 41
and the signs of the times

1.1 Introduction 42

1.2 God’s plan and mission 43

1.3 The Kingdom of God 45

1.4 Reading the signs of the times 49

1.5 People on the planet and on the move 50

1.6 People in Australia 52

1.7 People and religion 53

1.8 Catholics in Australia 56

1.9 Women in Australia and the Church 59

1.10 People and inequality 62

1.11 People and climate change 64

1.12 People and institutions 66

1.13 Australia and the nuclear threat 68

1.14 Church communications 71

1.15 The Catholic Church and Australia’s First Peoples 73

1.16 Other signs of the times 76

Some discussion questions 76

Part 2: People of God 83

2.1 Israel: People of God and light to the nations 84

2.2 The Halakah 85

2.3 The Gentile question 87

2.4 Paul’s charter of equality and freedom 88

2.5 Vatican II and the People of God 89

2.6 Theology of the Laity – Sensus fidei fidelium 93

2.7 Vatican II and the rights and duties of Christ’s faithful 95

2.8 Lex Ecclesiae Fundamentalis and Justice in the World 96

2.9 Charter of Rights and Responsibilities for Christ’s Faithful 99

2.10 Recommendations 101

Some discussion questions 104

Part 3: Church Governance 109

3.1 The meaning of governance 110

3.2 Church authority 113

3.3 Governance and power in the Church 118

3.4 The Royal Commission and governance 124

3.5 The culture of clericalism 127

3.6 Women and church governance 130

3.7 Conclusion 134

3.8 Recommendations 137

Some discussion questions 144

Part 4: Pastoral leadership and
Parish Ministry 149

4.1 The sacraments and signs of the times 150

4.2 The Sacraments of Initiation: Baptism,

Confirmation, Eucharist 152

4.3 Sacrament of Penance or Reconciliation 156

4.4 Sacrament of Holy Orders 161

4.5 Bishops and the Episcopate 163

4.6 Priests and priesthood 165

4.6.1 Clericalism 166

4.6.2 Selection, screening and initial formation
of candidates for the priesthood 167

4.6.3 Celibacy 170

4.6.4 Ordination of viri probati 172

4.6.5 Ordination of women to the priesthood 174

4.7 Deacons, the Diaconate and women 178

Getting Back On Mission

4.8 Matrimony 182

4.9 Sacred Liturgy 186

4.10 Parish ministry in crisis 190

4.11 Shortage of priests for parish ministry 192

4.12 Overseas-sourced priests 195

4.13 Permanent deacons 198

4.14 Pastoral Associates 200

4.15 Pastoral Strategies for parish ministry 203

4.16 Recommendations 206

Some discussion questions 220

Part 5: Plenary Council: process and
procedures 229

5.1 Synods and councils in Australia 230

5.2 Plenary Council 2020/21 234

5.3 Three stages of a plenary council 236

5.4 Who are called to attend the Council? 238

5.5 Who and how many can be invited as guests
to the Council? 243

5.6 Who can vote at the Plenary Council? 246

5.7 Plenary Council agenda 249

5.8 Liturgy at the Plenary Council 252

5.9 How will voting at the Plenary Council take place? 253

5.10 Writing the legislation 257

5.11 Recommendations 258

Some discussion questions 262

Conclusion 267

Appendices 271
1. Open Letter to Pope Benedict XVI and the
Catholic Bishops of Australia (August 2011) 272
2. Open Letter to the Bishops of Australia – ‘Please Listen
and Act Now’ (May 2017) 275
3. A Model Catholic Charter of Rights and Responsibilities
of Christ’s Faithful 278

PAT SAYS

Its wonderful that the Australian Catholics are putting so much effort into reform.

But they are up against the Vatican, the Hierarcht and the Clerical establishment.

People with power never relinquish it easily.

We need a PEOPLE POWER REVOLUTION to achieve RCC reform.

I’m not even sure it can ever happen.

I think the RCC Cancer is not curable 😦

Can you overturn 1700 years of dysfunction?

.

192 replies on “AUSTRALIAN CATHOLIC WANT TOTAL CHURCH REFORM.”

Sorry to say this, but these Catholics are pissing into the wind.

Such reform as they seek requires at least a gentle inclination in that direction, and this in turn requires moral probity; I see no evidence of either in the Romanist so-called ‘hierarchy’. And Romanist priests themselves are too self-interested (too hung up on what they perceive as the high and holy staus of priesthood, even though most people now recognise this as a joke without a punchline) to protest openly and publcly for such reform; they are the ultimate moral cowards. Uselessness collectively personified.

Until ordinary Catholics grow the hell up and stop financially propping up these useless, indolent, workshy #$*&, they will continue in the same, self-adulating, monstrance-gimmick, useless vein.

I know what I do when something is no longer of use to me: I throw it out … with the rest of the trash. 😄

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9.17pm: Repeat, Repeat, Repeat – would you turn off that repeat button Magna? Same condescending words, same ugliness of expsession, same judgments. There is nothing NEW in this diatribe, nothing constructive, imaginative or visionary. Why you should be so fixated on the same remedy of HATRED is not unusual: It’s your daily mantra as a solution for all wrongs in the church and priesthood. When you, Magna, ccome out of the shadows and lead the reform you propose, gather courageously the protesters you dream of and act and stand alongside with them to initiate such reforms, then I’ll respect you. If you are genuine – which of course you’re not – about true, meaningful change, then be brave and be the first to attach your NAME to a new movement for God’s people. I’m just too busy in my parish. You admire Pat’s courage, so why don’t you join the Oratory and be a force for the vision you promulgate. Here’s your moment which was denied you since that sad day when you walked alone through Maynooth gates deemed unfit. But don’t give up: God writes straight with crooked lines and as you think so highly of your credentials, offer yourself to Him who can work wonders through us…Now since you don’t put money on church plates, here’s your big moment to put your money where your mouth is. We await the scrolling open of your master plan!!

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10:44 am

Fr. I’m Too Busy,
What are your solutions to the wrongs in the church and priesthood? Zilch.
What constructive, imaginative, visionary master plan have you to offer? Zilch.

God writes straight with crooked lines—now, where did you hear that old catchphrase?
Gaynooth, no doubt.

Guru’s were known to have worked in Gaynooth infecting students with all kinds of notions. Less of the crooked and more of the straight in the church, might make life a lot easier for everyone, including God!

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10.44

But – but didn’t you know that truth must always be repeated, until the penny drops?

Isn’t this what you do? Preaching the Gospel over and over? I suppose the repetition is necessary because no one has ever seen a dirty Romanist parasite-cum-moocher actually live the stuff he preaches. 😀

This is, I’m afraid, why I have to sing the same old song, because until you all start to ‘live’ the Gospel 🤣, I’ll have no reason to rewrite the lyrics. 😀

Guffaw – guffaw- guffaw 😂😂😂🤧

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Absolutely, Magna. The reply by the hater incorporates several of their avoidance techniques including that you are saying nothing new. This is merely a pretext to ignore your uncomfortable truth, since why should you say anything new when they’re just carrying on as usual.

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MC, you don’t like anything apart from the drink and dole money, you mooching, sponging, still living at parent’s home, dismissed seminarian failure.

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11:29 am

I have no idea how MC earns his livelihood. That’s his private business.

The dole, as you call jobseekers allowance, is a social right for those unemployed.
I hope you never have to depend on jobseekers allowance for any length of time.
Thousands are currently dependant on jobseekers allowance or a Covid-19 social
welfare payment.

A sneering condescending patronising stupid comment from a professional christian financially dependant on the laity. Did you ‘play the game’ to be ordained?

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A@11:29: Read, digest, and learn from 11:47’s comment below. I particularly like the last paragraph.
MMM

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11.29

Keep posting. Don’t quit.

By the Law of Averages, you will, someday, say something … reliable.

Guffaw – guffaw-guffaw 🤧

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St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle, be our protection against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God rebuke him we humbly pray; and do thou, O Prince of the Heavenly host, by the power of God, cast into hell Satan and all the evil spirits who prowl about the world seeking the ruin of souls.
Amen.

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Magna @ 9.17pm
“Pissing in the wind…”
I see you have a very special gift, you are quite remarkable! Unlike some…

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With all your years of experience, Pat, why don’t you put your energy into people power revolution? .You do a great deal of talking about it. If people seek change, which your Oratory offers, why aren’t people flocking to you? Change of any meaningful kind is always difficult but we should face our challenges with courage.

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5.30 maybe an authority they were told to look up to swopped the faith for non-faith hence nothing to pass on

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More like Geriatrics for Renewal. As I expected, when I looked on the website they are all Boomers and older. No doubt their children are lapsed and their grandchildren are unbaptised.
Why don’t the old moaners join the Anglicans? Their wish list is met in full there.
Here’s the coffin-dodgers:
https://youtu.be/7kBDRuiKcKY

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Are your children lapsed and are your grandchildren unbaptised? If so you failed to pass on the Faith, just like those white-haired complainers in Australia.

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I see you date the dysfunction from the Romanisation of Christianity but surely much of the dysfunction goes back to Paul, a master at hating self, sex and women?

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It goes all the way back to Abraham?

To God as well, I suppose. 🤔

Christ! What the hell do Christians worship? 😱

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Lol no, not back to Abraham – although if you really want to keep going back there is allegedly a sea change round about 4,000 years ago.
I date specifically Christian dysfunction to Paul because, well, you’ve read his letters!

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8.47: More worrying, what the hell do you worship? Your big toe?? Mags the Rot….your heart and soul are robbed from you through drink…

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10.47
Seriously (‘Father’? 🤔), it’s a reasonable question, given the things Christians have done, or approved, in the name of their God.
Who, precisely, is the god you worship? Does he approve of concealing the rape of children by priests in order to ‘avoid scandal’? A succession of popes from around the middle of the 19th century would answer ‘yes’, because in the name of your God, they acted canonically to protect the perpetrators and to endanger additional children.
And in the name of your God, people were savagely tortured and murdered simply because they chose to think for themselves.
In the name of your God, too, clerics in your church continue to ignore Christ’s clear instruction about discipleship and servitude : he expressly links the two.
So yes: what the hell do Christians worship? Because I do not see the Nazarene represented by their conduct, especially in the institutional Romanist Church. 🙄

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2.37
Of course I am! Where else would the experience of Romanism drive a body?
Certainly not into the arms of Jesus. 🙄

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Magna you have a very valid point here. One of the problems is if they ever remember their alleged god he is a god with a rather arbitrary judgement. For example he could have forbidden humans owning other humans but instead decided to forbid mixing meat and dairy. He also ‘designed’ the penis with skin covering the end and since has told some but not all of his followers to cut the skin off!
Not a very convincing divinity.

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5.39

Thank you.

Christianity, including the Bible, is in large part man-made and man-written respectively. There is little divine about either.

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A classic non sequitur at 5:09 – but I imagine that’s a nuance beyond your ability – drunk or sober.

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7.28
C’mon! Tell us that presumed ‘non-sequitur’.
Or are you in the habit of using Latin terms you don’t understand?😕

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Church Reform. Oh Pat I am laughing so hard her. Seriously. I am in pain I am laughing so hard. Church Reform. Hahaha. Pat thank You for such a great laugh on this Satirday Morning. I wont make any further comment on this. Church reform. LMFAO. Hahahaha.

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7:23 AM
Good night fly hi.
Begorra fly you hit the nail on the head.
There’s no action man to lead the charge.
Have a read of the godfather or the cardinal sins
or the exorcist for a bit of escapism.
May the Force be with you. +
Good night hi fly.

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Just a random thought…..anybody know what has happened to Bishop Kieran Conry, ex of Arundel and Brighton ? Is he still a bishop ? Is he ministering still somewhere ? Is he married ? Has he taken to religion and celibacy anew ? All has gone quiet. I liked him, but I must admit to being dumbfounded when he said in his defence that he avoided preaching about sexuality morality, so that meant he wasn’t a hypocrite ! Only in the Catholic Church can you get double think like that !

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I don’t know this but knowing how the institution works you can bet he’s on a comfortable pension in a church owned property and has signed a gagging agreement.

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Probably. In any other walk of life he’d have been out on his ear for professional indiscipline. But, he was the golden boy of the bishops’ conference, and was always talked about in gushing terms as a man with a bright future. I’m sure they are looking after their mate who has fallen on hard times. Usually when these clerics get caught out they suddenly take to religion again, because they realise that they would have nothing if they just leave. So, they make sure to knuckle under so that they will be able to live comfortably and securely. Just so they know that we are not fooled !

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There’s no way Kieran Conry had a vocation. He’s straight, ffs. Should have been weeded out at application stage as we don’t need strights in seminaries.

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9.27: That’s an ignorant comment as I’m sure you’ve brought memories for Pat. I’m surprised that you, Pat, would print this comment. It’s horrible.

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I have to say that I have now gone beyond the aspiration for reform of the Catholic Church. Having distanced myself for a whole range of reasons over the last few years, I find that I don’t really miss it at all. I quite like not belonging anymore, and pursuing different paths and none, being as agnostic as I am believing in anything, and just taking life as it comes. It is really quite liberating when you make the move away from all of the hobbling burdens that the Church and religion in general have put on one over the decades.
So, I’m quite content to leave the Catholic Church to sort itself out, which it probably won’t because it is so fixated on its own navel and incapable of raising its sights. The core elements of the Gospel, which in reality align with the innate goodness of the human being, are worth keeping, but as for the rest of the nonsense that is fed to its followers, well, that should be left to wither on the vine.
The Catholic Church is not alone in this. Today, or tomorrow, or perhaps even the next day – depending on when you can see the moon, or not, or it might be there but you can’t see it because of the clouds, or the Imam looking for it might be myopic and not see it – will be the end of Ramadan and the feast of Eid. This is another religion that feeds its followers with mechanistic nonsense, and has a draconian hold over people because of social and cultural pressure. I have lived with and worked with Muslims of various flavours, and by and large I have found that it is a religion that encourages duplicity and dysfunction as much as the Catholic Church does. Like Christianity, it is based on stories and myths that have been used to shackle people in the interests of control and power, So, I shall not be converting to the religion of the Prophet !
I encourage you, dear reader, to cast off these institutional creations and let your mind and your spirit find its own way, unencumbered by untruths and lies and abuse of power and coverup and all the silly nonsense that is peddled in order to keep you in line. You might not know where you are going or what you believe, but there is a liberty and freedom in that, so much so that you can arrive where you want, when you want and how you want. If there is a God – and there well might be – surely he/she/it/they will lead us in the right way, if that God is one of love and goodness ? Experience the journey !

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Thank you @ 9:39 for an eminently wise and sensible comment. It mirrors my views of the past 50+ years since I too cast aside the shibboleths of religion.
The antics of cathbots and holy water hens remind me of mice running on a treadmill: expending a lot of energy but getting nowhere!
MMM

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Pity A@12:26 whose critical faculties can’t even distinguish between 50 and 90. Makes me wonder about the rest of his acumen.
MMM

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You didn’t give it up 90+ years ago, MMM, if you are still hanging around religious blogs.

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12.16
I should much, much rather listen to an atheist pronounce on Christianity: they see things about religion that Christians, with telling lack of honesty and skill, chose to avoid, or deny.
I have watched … Tch! … more videos by atheists on YouTube than I can recall. And they are always surprised when I post a comment to declare myself a Christian. I gather they are astonished when I tell them why I view their videos.

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Reforms are a pie in the sky. Vatican, pope and cardinals are in self preservation mode. They protect the church at all costs at the expense of ourselves.

There is one new Bishop who tells other churches in dioceses not to use video cam in live masses on Mon to sat except for Sun. It seems to me that he’s an attention seeker as he used to work in archbishop of Dublin residence.

Other ways of stopping RCC greed and power.

1. Stop giving money or wills or house or lands to RCC. Heard one priest badgering aged elderly woman to give him the house in her will. He got the house and sold it. Proceeds of the house went into his pocket.

2. Strip their charity status.

3. Strip their power–how?

4. Remember. Cardinal law, mc Carrick, marciel, Smyth, fortune, Murphy et as a deep reminder as to why RCC at highest level can’t be trusted. Their motto as I believe is ‘ the less you know the better’ as regards to RCC secrecy. Publicity of their wrong sinful deeds such as sex abuses and exposing them is one way of breaking their secrets.

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The charitable status is a major thing – in fact if the church paid tax on its donations it would actually be doing good to others instead of claiming to be doing good to others.
I personally don’t think religion of any sort should be given tax breaks except for direct charitable works.
*However* charitable status is one of the few things which give people a lever over the church by charity authorities having leverage over how a charity can spend its funds, but in general I don’t see the promotion of religion as a charitable thing so would say it shouldn’t be given the tax breaks of a charity.

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Always value your contributions, Deag Guy. You speak with great insight and experience of what the Church is really like. And when I write “the Church” I do indeed include the laity, most of whom have been at best sheep ( to use Magna’s term ) or willing enablers in collusion with the clergy.

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12:19
I agree.
DG has very good insightful informative comments based on experience.
While some of the laity have been enablers in collusion with clerics, especially the medical profession, I believe huge numbers of lay people are unaware of the depth of corruption in the church. Most people are too busy getting on with their lives.

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12.19pm

The biggest obstacle to reform or more specifically their corrupt behaviour and their unethical morals.

As we could see one way of changing their corrupt behaviour, their attitude, unethical morals is money.

That’s why I mentioned strip their charity status thus they would pay full tax same for any business organisation. By stripping charity status might change RCC behaviour.

Other way of this is to stop contributing your monies to RCC until they change their corruption and their behaviour in relation to corruption itself.

You mention ‘the church’ as the laity can’t influence their bishops or cardinals or popes. Cos bishops or cardinals are influenced by their CEO – Pope.

Many bishops and cardinals see the laity as sheep with no voice borne out of their experience. One thing that change them is to hit their pockets (aka monies).

The problem with bishops and cardinals was that they are incapable of changing themselves or church reform which is impossible. That was because they are stuck in the rut.

RCC always have been interested in money as they have no interest in the laity. One look at Kikdorrey Church where Bishop cream have no real interest in re- consecrate the altar/Church. That tells you a lot more about his attitude towards the laity in kikdorrey and also his spiritual life as well.

But at the same time, felt soory for good priests who did the hard work and then bishop undermined priests all their hard work.

Do we ever hear good priests protesting against their own bishop over abuses?

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DG, if good priests do that they go from being good priests to sacked / scapegoat priests.

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By Post Author

Significant that nobody so far today has any confidence whatsoever in reform movements such as Catholics for Renewal cited above. Magna typically expressed our reservations crudely yet accurately as pissing into the wind. How many times have we been here before since the Council opened up the possibility of reform? Paul VI panicked by seeking to impose Humanae Vitae, and then we got JPII and Ratzinger. For all his fine gestures, what progress has actually been made under Francis? The problem is as ever the clerical establishment which cannot admit they were ever wrong, so, as ever, resort to subterfuge.

As was pointed out yesterday, there will continue to be a rump of traditionalists doing their own thing with varying degrees of probity and integrity, and a mainstream Church which is emptying because most Catholics no longer have trust in their pastors, and know that in matters of sexual morality in particular they are preaching bull-shit which they neither believe nor practise themselves.

I too entirely agree with 09:39 am: set yourself free to explore possibilities; should you find an intentional community which suits you, join it; if not move on … the Lord is still with you.

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What institutionalised religions, including the Roman Catholic Church, fear most is that people will begin to think for themselves and to forge their own pilgrimage in life, either by themselves or in smaller groups of their choosing. The Church has for centuries managed to avoid this by inflicting huge emotional and psychological burdens of guilt, most of it focusing on sexual morality, on the people, and has been able to force people in to submission to its will and authority. All, of course, according to the will of God, or so they say. However, developments over the last few decades, in particular in ways of communication and access to information, as well as an awareness of the duplicity and dysfunction of the clerical class, has enabled people to break free and begin to make up their own minds and to make their own way, without fear or guilt. Once the dam has been breached, it is only a matter of time until it comes tumbling down. If the Church is to have any future it needs to reimagine itself as a way of helping people to discover their own way, rather than trying to resist and to reconfigure a model that has been shown to be built on shaky and questionable foundations. I am not confident that the Church will take this new approach, I do not hear any voices calling for it or supporting it from amongst clergy. Surely they know that the game is up ? As is their time.

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11.04 and 11.21: You both deliberately respond maliciously to my comment at 10.44: my reference to being ‘too busy’ was tongue in cheek: my reference to money was by way of asking Magna to put forward his brilliant blueprint as a pathway for renewal: the “God writes straight with crooked lines” is a phrase used by Pat occasionally, so I use it in the context that all of us, irrespective of our human condition can be conduits for God’s renewing graces, if we chhose to follow Christ and believe in God. I ask those who continually excoriate priests and church to outline their programmes and visions for a new Church. I admit that I am unable to do this on my own. Along with a great parish community our parish is a very welcoming, caring and good place. I try to build on this with others and together we have achieved much for the good and betterment of our community. Xuring the pandemic to date, I have been hugely inspired by a “model” of church community in action whereby people lived in a truly Christian way. There is hope by this approach. But I am a little lost and overwhelmed at times by the larger picture of a broken church and priesthood. I welcome other view points and opinions. I am not the person your cynicism perceives. Narratives become tiresome when repeated daily, narratives whose only aim is to smash priests into the ground. Despite the truth that many of us have lived up to ideals with huge difficulty, and continue to live ministry as it is intended – for the good and service of parishioners. I fail at times but I do not believe the vitriol, nastiness and cynical commentary are always deserved. Incidentally, my education was at UCD and Clonliffe and then at Trinity….not ever in Maynooth.

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I can sense a genuine desire in you for that “new church”. And a fellow Clonliffonian 🙂 I sense nothing negative in your comment and that touches me.
A renewed church, it it’s possible at all, will have to be one that has rid itself of clericalism and of hierarchy as we know it. It will have to put primary emphasis on the NT teachings of Jesus and relegate canon law to a very far back dark room. Authority and governance in the church will truly have to adopt the service mode and abandon the power mode.
The problem is that the church is now an established institution that will never want to let go. It will either have to be abandoned or dragged and screaming into Christ mode.
What a formidable task.

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1.54

Self-pity is not an endearing quality, priest, and when protracted, makes an adult, like you, appear brattishly childish, and deserving a boxed ear.

You thought you were being clever at my expense, didn’t you? But you were too subtle for your own good, and it all blew up in your stupid face.

No one responded maliciously: every counter-comment was reasonable, given the way you presented yourself. As a priestly fool.

If you would take a break from maudlin’ navel gazing and Job-like counting of personal woes, real or imagined, you would see that Magna had no need of a ‘brilliant Master plan’ for ecclesial reform, because the original, and simplest, has always been with us in the Gospel. Jesus himself is the proto-type for discipleship of him, but will the Romanist Church, and her parasitical, mooching priests (men like you) pay it any attention? You’ve now had 2000 years to so so, years in which you have ignored the express teaching of Christ for your own aggrandisement. You will never change, because Christ was never your goal: it is why you commit yourselves, at ordination, to an institution historically proven, again and again, wholly unsuited to calling itself ‘Christian’, much less that supercilious, grandiose utter nonsense ‘one true church’.

Save your tears, priest, and your whining self-pity. You impress no one.

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Maybe it’s because I have not lost faith in some priests completely – even though I’ve had every reason to do so?

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By Post Author

2.59; Drunken One, who do you think you impressed or impress? No one but the image in your mirror. Sadly, Magna, you prove the point I made earlier. Your are all talk, complaints and no action or have anything worthwhile to offer except the usual, predictable diatribes from your REPEAT button. Hatred, as we all know, solves nothing. The truth is – Mags the Rot doesn’t care about anyone or anything but repeats himself here as it’s the only forum that gives him the belief that he’s relevant…Yes, as relevant and useful as a fly on a hippos arse…utterly, utterly, useless! A sick psycho.

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3.06
Tell me, then, those priests who don’t pull rank over the laity in their little fiefdoms.
Tell me the priests who reject worldly hierarchy by having dropped the hierarchical title ‘Father’.
Tell me those priests who do not see themselves, and present themselves, as shepherds, because this, too, is hierarchical.
Tell me the priests who risk everything to obtain the pearl of great price by publicly and openly demanding the reforms they know are desperately needed and whose absence continues to wound the Body of Christ.
Tell me the priests who refused to pledge obedience, at ordination, to a bishop and his successors in place of Christ.
Tell me… Tell me anything, but give me evidence. Your confidence in ‘some’ priests, while good in itself, is not sufficient, because each of them has drawn deeply from a clericalist theology of priesthood that can only have disadvantaged them, and everyone else unfortunate enough to find himself or herself in their shadow.

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2.59: Go on then Mr. Carta. If the master plan is so simple why don’t we witness any of it in you? It’s certainly not caught you yet! Why don’t you appear from the shadows, calmly, kindly, humbly, decently and caringly – all requiring moral courage and deep faith in GOD – and recreate this WAY OF JESUS.. No, you don’t possess the intelligence nor the emotional, mental or spiritual integrity to do so. Most truthfully, you are the quintessential moral bully and coward. All talk behind a pseudonym and a laptop which keep you hidden, useless and contemptible. Your type should stay in the bottom of the barrel. Worse than uselessness and crippled by narcissistic traits that have killed your humanity.

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Bishop Pat, does he still impress you? Did you read his comment at 3.18? A testament to the power of Christianity to run … skin-deep. 🙄

I am neither drunk, nor was I obliged to leave Maynooth. Yet the priest who impressed you, just for vengeance, repeats these lies.

You’re too easily impressed, Pat.

As for the Romanist parasite-cum-moocher-cum-fool at 3.18, it has all blown up in your stupid face again, hasn’t it?

You, and almost every other Romanist priest who posts here, makes for me my case against the institutional Romanist Church, and undermines Christianity’s Central tenet: that God’s grace can transform souls.

Bless you, lads, for witnessing to the Gospel. 👿

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3.35

Can you see the fallacy in your post? Can you, priest?

You challenge me to ‘appear from the shadows’, and then, ironically, deny my ability to do so. You’re confused. But hey! 😃 At least you’re comical. 😅

You didn’t address any of my points about the failings of Romanist priesthood and those of the institution you serve over Christ. Typical of Romanist priests who post here: they attack the messenger whose message they hate and would rather bury, no doubt along with the messenger.

None of you has ever persuasively addressed my points, that is, ‘those who bothered’. I guess its for at least two reasons: first, you know the points are true; and second, you’d rather conceal, or distract from, their veracity by ‘having a go’ at me.

Pathetic. No; I mean it: pathetic.

Nero, according to legend, fiddled while Rome burned.

Rome is still burning, but the fiddling these days is usually with kids.

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Pat when the church history of the 21st century is written you will attract a special mention amongst independent bishops for your willingness to engage publicly with your critics on this blog and your willingness to try to see other people’s points of view, or at least state them.
This… I suppose ‘vulnerability’ is the word is quite something and the people who comment here can forget that many of us have had it literally beaten out of us, or they wouldn’t be so intent to keep beating the victims including Magna.

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1:54 pm

If there was less crookery, corruption, cover up and criminality in the Institutional church, God’s renewing graces might flow more freely both inside and outside the institution.
If more clergy followed Christ, believed in God and lived the Gospel rather than lip service from so many, the priesthood would likely be perceived very differently publicly.

Children and vulnerable adults of clerical abuse don’t and didn’t deserve what they endure.
My bishop wanted me destroyed to protect your clerical colleagues who were corrupt immoral and criminal. So too bad if you feel narratives aim to smash priests into the ground.
The clerical fraternity who consider themselves ontologically altered are also of the earth, dust, glorified clay, like everyone else.. And you guys think you can destroy lives, be unaccountable, withhold justice and truth, re-traumatize victims, all rationalized for ‘the good of the church.’, while simultaneously preach the gospel of ‘Jesus Christ’! Shouting louder as an Archbishop preached will only draw more attention to clerical hypocrisy.

Many victims of clerical abuse are prematurely UNDER the ground as a consequence.

The problem is not lack of faith or faith ‘model’ in the community —-abstractions—and clergy are terrific talking in the abstract—- the problem is in the clergy, the institution and duplicity. Repent and believe the Gospel! Blueprint beginning….

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You ask for a concrete plan and I have one, which I sense will be distasteful to many readers of this blog.
I should say that I now think reform of the RC church is impossible because it will not accept this. Therefore my master plan is a harm reduction plan and can be summarised easily.
1. The church should be stripped of charitable status and forced to pay the costs of mental health treatment for its victims and the costs of imprisonment for its clergy.
2. Personnel of the church who fail to report crimes would also face criminal penalties and the church would be forced to pay any costs to the public purse.
3. There isn’t a step 3 because one and two would sufficiently cut the hierarchy down to size and any further needed reform would happen naturally.
You did ask for a master plan.

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@1.54 P.M. Thank you for your Priestly Ministry in an Archdiocese where you do not get much support or encouragement from your Shepherd. I know many hardworking and genuine Priests In Dublin who do great Ministry in their Parishes. Keep up the good work. Prayers for you and your Parish Community. I hope Dublin gets a great new Appointment as Archbishop.

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Let’s call the bobbies…
Picks up phone… dials 999. Operator: “Hello, emergency services how can we help you…” Alex the kidder: “Hi, my name is Alex the kidder and I have been caught out and I feel a total redfaced twat; all and sundirie now know. The cat is well and truly out of the bag. Could you please help us subdue the victim from speaking up any further… pretty, pretty, please…?”
Operator: “Oh, I’m sorry love, this is a Civil matter; unless a Criminal Offence has been committed, say like, somebody actually breaking the law or making up false allegstions
which have No Merit, then we will Not be getting involved”.
Alex the kidder: “(Crying and kicking off sounds) but you have to silence him, we are the RCc And I get PAYED to protect the abusers… So, you are not going to do ANYTHING, then?”
Operator: “Go do your own fucking dirty work; we are here to serve and protect – not to assist you guys in enabling abuse of children and vulnerable adults. And by the way, your department are the ones currently under the microscope. IICSA are aware of FarrerDayCage’s lying statement, including – NOT LIMITED TO – ALL the evidence… (sound of handset being put down… by operator–Of course…. Aigburth Rd.
… BT exchange EOL tone kicks in (End Of Line tone) through DSLAM (Digital Subscriber Line Accex Multiplexer)… for the geeks out there: a Siemens SURPASS hiX 5625… yes, with generic auxillary/mon., Ethernet port…
Hmmm, 192.168.1. ** (generic SubMask) plugged DIRECTLY into a Ubiquity NanoBeam 5ac private PtP-Link(Point to Point). 20MHz Freq. only set to 10MHz cos it’s a part of My PRIVATE NETWORK which is bouncing all over tbe fucking show.
(Oh, and 5MHz right upto 80MHz is Licence Free spectrum, reserved for WiFi, CCTV and and PtP private/public use.
… Ps for all those creeps out there who can’t be bothered getting off your fat arses to turn off lamps and other devices… Don’t use Alexa and the likes…
They come with 4 gigabytes of NAND Non-Volitile [flash] Memory (NVM nust means it keeps all data even if powered down).
And… 256MB ( But, owing to Alexa’s TI DM3725 ARM Cortex-A8 Core Digital Media Processor’s marvelous ability to compress/utilisation/compression, her RAM is more Circa 190 – 220 odd GB – YES! 220 ODD GIGABYTES!!
f LPDDR1 RAM (Random Accces Memory) kinda like a cconvererbelt of memory with buffer/memory.
To give you and idea… a good quality computer comes with between 4 to 8GB RAM (POSSIBLY 16GB if you’re into gaming (WHICH YOU WILL know from reading this–I AM NOT). A ‘TOP SPEC’ fast as FUCK desktop PC can suport only 64GB. Soo, you can magine how much/long that CACHE/cconveyerbelt holds before it falls falls off…
Alexa is always sending and recieving data to servers. The destinatiins of which are subject to her Flash/RAM.
HAVE A GOOD DAY GUYS!

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@5:41pm I did! I look forward to this poster and if in any way posting here gives a voice to their cries for justice, denied elsewhere +Pat is facilitating a process now in shadow, but then as clear as day!

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There you go. Happy memories of days picketing Maynooth. The RCC bishops always seem to want justice everywhere else but not in their own organisation.

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Suffering from serious deteriorating mental health; paranoid and delusional... Aka CRAZYsays:

Here is a song for Alex the kidder.
Ye can’t kid a kidder… ye can’t shit a shitter!
– Patsy Cline – CRAZY.
…Crazy for lying… Crazy for fucking trying, Alex. “SUFFERING FROM SERIOUS AND DETERIORATING MENTAN HEALTH; PARANOID And DELUSIONAL.” On your BIKE!

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3.30: What an appropriate song choice in honour of Crazy Lonely Magna. Brilliant…Magna should play it while standing naked in front of his mirror!!

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PrEp-ping i(pre-exposure prophylaxis) is very common and popular in the gay community as a way of preventing oneself contracting HIV if the other sexual partner happens to be HIV positive and infectious. Along with the drug treatments that are keeping people who are HIV positive alive and well, and as a side effect mean that the level of HIV in their system is kept so low that they are not likely to give it to anybody else, these prophylactic and treatment drug regimes are very effective at helping to control HIV infections. That’s something good and should be celebrated. And, if somebody is being responsible in using PrEp, or is looking after themselves with HIV drug treatments in order to keep well and to minimise passing on the virus, that is responsible behaviour. I have no doubt that we will get some people on here telling us that the only responsible way is to be chaste and celibate, and give us lectures about the sexual behaviour of other people, but we won’t take any lessons from them seeing that their priests are for the most part incapable of taking their own advice but which they insist on giving to the rest of us. Do as I say, not as I do…..

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What you folks don’t realise is that “Magna Carta” is a priest deliberately being outrageous for the craic and you are all falling for it hook, line and sinker every time.

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Bishop Pat why are you wearing a Roman Collar when you went to Conliffe and not educated at Rome.

This maybe a new thing in the UK educated in Rome Roman Collar and in Maymooth or in the UK just a clerical collar.

Even Father McHugh wears Black when if he is MC to the Archbishop or Bishop it is purple or is he waiting for the red.(if it ever happens)

Is it class distinction.

Maybe an announcements this week over Dublin.

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6:34 pm

Does it matter? What colours did Jesus wear?

What colours did uncle Ted wear, or Maciel or Smyth or….

You sounds a wee bit over-enamoured by ecclesiastical frills titles and pomp.

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Absolute bolderdash rubbish from Jim who can’t compose without mentioning bishop, archbishop. Obsessed character.

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Pat,
Congratulations! That was a first class performance in front of the cameras: coherent, calm, cogent snd compelling logic. Brilliant!

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That was Dalys problem. I was articulating something that infuriated him.

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By Post Author

3.47: No Miss Maggie, when you play with fire, expect to get burnt. If you throw out muck, lies and hatred, do expect that sometimes it will fly back and knock you down and make you look stupid. You are obviously fuming with anger that most of us discern your psychotic madness, fuelled by drink. Yes, you are a danger – to yourself primarily. Continue to play “cry baby” with Daddy Pat and he’ll relent soon. If only you took a short step back and actually analyse the content of your contributions, you’ll discover the repeat ad nauseam narratives – all underpinned by an abnormal hatred towards all priests. That surely exposes you as deeply psychologically unwell. Mags, for the record: my abilities and ministry and service to all parishes where I’ve worked is well documented. All positive and I am grateful to God for the incredible opportunities to be of life-giving service to so many. A recently diagnosed illness has slowed my down temporarily but I will recover, whereas you will never recover from hatred, distortions of truth (lies), anger, jealousy or rage. These negatives which you nurture ever since being flung out of the seminary have made you a pitiable, piece of humanity. When your theme of hate speech is so repetitive, it becomes an ugliness. And If Pat approves of my previous comment, what’s your beef? Stop being the bully trying to punch everyine on this blog that sees through you. A total fake. Now, off you go to your cave….. 😂😂😂😂😎😎😂😂🐗🐗🐗🐗🐴🐴🐴🐱🐱🏡🏡🇦🇨🇦🇨🇦🇨🇦🇨…

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4.35
Still self-defensive.
Still not listening.
Still unwilling to change.
God be with your poor parishoners.
The Lord can call only so many times.

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Buckley,
What were you protesting about in the video? Fr m kane.. Was he in knock marriage bureau??
Interesting bit about the video that you two protested but none nowadays. I rarely hear any priest protesting. Met a priest way back Fr cashman in Wexford who protested with his Bishop. He stuck with it.. Don’t know if he’s alive or not now.

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Both Fr Keane and I had been summarily dismissed. Yes, Fr Keane founded the Knock Marriage Bureau.

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We were protesting that we had been dismissed by two bishops and PAT the bishops were protesting about injustices in South Africa.

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By Post Author

Keane was later reunited with the church and embraced Cardinal Connell. He died a priest of the Roman Catholic Church. According to the Irish Times, ”The reconciliation came as a great relief to the then 75-year-old after more than two decades of feeling shunned and isolated”.

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Poor Old Miss Marge Simpson has gone all crazy at 3.23 and 3.47. She despises those who see the real truth if her many personae. The only refuge from her misery is a gin and tonic and an all too often appearance on this blog. Makes her think she’s very needed. I can only imagine the hellhole she’ in due to confinement. Mags, if you prayed to the good Lord, he’s heal you. He’d soften that hard heart of yours. God doesn’t require you to be a nasty bitch 24 hours a day. No, No, dearie, he wants to hold you in the palm of his hand. Yes, you, sweet little baby maggie.. Shouldn’t this comfort you and help you grow uppppppppp!!!

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4.44: 😁😁😁🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣😁😁😋🤣🤣🤣😆😆😁😁….exactly what’s needed to rise above our exposure to Marge….🍒🍒🍒🍒🍒..

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4.44
Never mind me.
Ask the Lord to heal your appalling understanding of English grammar.
I’m sure he’ll oblige. 😅

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4.51PM
oh I see, was it CARDINAL daly dismissed you over what?
Don’t hear any priests protesting nowadays. Where are they? Gone?

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4:57
Didn’t Cardinal Cackle rap Brian D ‘Arcy on the knuckles after the Late Late episode?

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4:57pm

Weren’t they very sensitive re public criticism for very strong reasons so much was covered up.

I met Sean Fortune years ago. He tried to lure me to his den of iniquity.
The powers that be knew about characters like him.

Telling tales out of school on the fraternity was the unforgivable clerical sin.
No wonder you were shunned by the brotherhood.
How unchristian of those ‘in persona Christi’.

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I remember your protest in Maynooth. Archbishop Cassidy of Tuam made it known to his seminarians that they were not to talk to Fr Michael Kane. A Tuam second year did so anyway. The Archbishop found out but instead of being man enough to have it out with the student he got the Junior Dean to do the bollocking on his behalf.
To be fair to the Junior Dean (Fr Duhig) it was a very light ticking-off, done with a twinkle the eye, according to the rebel sem.

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5.33

And you are?

I swear to God the ability of some posters here classically to shoot themselves in the foot, through marked lack of intelligence and insight, is almost worth venerating.

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5.01: Magna, calm down, calm down. Your angst at every commentator today, even calling Pat’s judgment into question, your perpetual moaning like a cry baby, your bullying – all this is contributing to your mental health destruction. Would you be kind to yourself and just take a wee break from all the volcanic negativity that’s holding you in a grip. The sad news is that what you say makes absolutely no difference to my beliefs in priesthood or the Church or to the way I live my life. You are no icon to look up to, the opposite rather. I can thank God for priesthood. I can thank God, that, despite my many faults, I am able to minister in a powerful way to others. I know I am appreciated for that, as are countless other priests, Pat included. So Magna, go find a more isolated cave and give yourself the much needed blessing of peace and healing within. And, remember the wirds of Jesus for Ascension Sunday (that’s tomorrow!!), “..Know that I am with you always, yes, to the end of time..”. What hope! What promise! Grab these words.

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5.33: Holy Saint Magna!! Expose Marge! Do you want us to go into another lockdown? Imagine the stenchy smell of this monster! Expose him.- under the deep blue sea. Absolutely. 😆😆😆😆😆😆😆😁😁😁😁😁😎😎..soon..

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7.09: We could write an episode of Father Magna after today’s comments from him. Fr. Jack would be sober by comparison to this heap…feck off.. Drink..Drink.. Drink.. feck off. We can imagine Fr. Magna pushing poor Mrs. Doyle down the stairs to beat Fr. Jack to the drinks cabinet….😁😁🇦🇨🐷🐷🐷 🤣🤣🍋🍋🍋🍋🍋…suck on a lemon Fr. Mags…

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Pat, why do you allow Magna to bring your blig to such depraved depths with his constant poison and thus enabling his mad self destruction. It’s a macabre show all day with this pig taking over. Only a person lacking self awareness and respect would make such idiots of themselves. Psychologically, the multiple domains of this conglomerate, Magna, makes healing an impossible task.

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6.48

I don’t suppose the filthy conduct of (you?) and your Romanist colleagues with kids ‘gets’ you in quite the same way. 😲

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6:48

The standard of the blog is lowered by clerical abusive fraudsters masquerading as defenders of the church and the priesthood. Their vile vulgar abusive comments illustrate aspects of the large corrupt underbelly of the Institutional church. Shameful.

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6.14

I wonder, too, why Pat allows Romanist parasite-cum-moochers to contribute to his ‘blig’, given their past (and current?) ill-treatment of him, and their defending a priesthood and an institution that has brought, and continues to bring, such appalling evil into this world

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6:54
Not at all. They can hide behind their bishops frock when trouble catches up with them.

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Because Pat allows people to say what they think, including clerics. I actually think that’s one of the best features of this blog because they show themselves up for what they are are and don’t even realise they’re doing it. Magna is right – they’re not the brightest ⭐
And frankly who cares what Magna says? He doesn’t have a public role to maintain but the clergy do and are remarkably quick to let the pious mask slip under cover of anonymity.
You are doing a great service to the rest of humanity by helping the reputation of your church sink even further, guys.

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7.28

Your last sentence is a marvel of brevity and precision in a single thought.

Yes, almost every time one of these parasites-cum-moochers posts a comment, he adds weight to my argument that Romanist priesthood is morally rotten, along with the worldly institution it unswervingly serves.

Keep posting, lads!

A-hah-hah-hah 😅

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Bp Pat, will you be… well, let’s just say, probing JPL again next week? I always enjoy another instalment in the ongoing saga.

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I will have nothing to do with priests following abuse as a vulnerable young adult.
I will not put myself at risk again. The posts from priests to this blog confirm and reinforce for me my views in having nothing to do with them.

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7.12: Your abuse was and is a horrendous violation and personal hurt. I am sorry you cannot feel trust for any priest now. Also, most comments on this blog are by non clerics, ex priests and ex seminarians. You can tell by the repetitive themes and language in comments and many of them comment several times during the day. Some comments, a small few, are from very mixed up priests but any priest with self respect aren’t too bothered with this blog. Priest who attempt to be serious about issues are torn to shreds, sadly.

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9:49 pm
The abuse I experienced ruined my life.
I know from my experience priests or bishops are not to be trusted.

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Methinks poor vinegar-tits Mags would love to be a parasite-cum-moocher herself. All that cock and none for Magsy. Poor cow.

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7.21

Thank you! 😄

You’ve wonderfully represented the moral nature of Romanist priesthood to a tee.

Keep posting … please! 😅

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7.21: What a smart comment about that wan, Cartie Wheels. He keeps swirling about in drunken states and shaming himself more by each comment. Other MEN were asked to leave the seminary but remain sane, intact and rational. This little geezer, Cartie Wheel, has gone mad, psycho, always looking for attention. He knows no man would have him, thus the projection of hatred, envy and poison vented against all. Psychologically, of course this anger is primarily a dangerous self-loathing for what he failed to achieve…priesthood. God has spared his people.

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8.05: More embarrassing responses and self degradation from Magna. What a pity. Someone who could possibly effect great good reduces himself to the lowest common denominator. Shame Magna, shame for you.

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I think Pat should do a blog on Magna Carta. He likes to give it but eh can he take it?

I wonder

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7:50
Hi Magna,
I don’t judge people on their intellect, grammar or ability to spell; these things are trivial and not important. It’s pretentious and condescending to do so. This blog is not an intellectual article, it is a free space for all to input their thoughts equally. Your go-to defence on this blog is to talk about grammar and spelling which just shows how truly insecure you are. It is an Ad Hominem attack – you attack the person not the argument. I judge people on their strength of character, goodwill and ability to be charitable, for which, you have none present.

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8.16
Can Magna Carta take it?😕
Take what?😞
The abuse he parries from Romanist parasites-cum-moochers, so skilfully, almost every day? 😎
Must I spoonfeed you the answer that should have been obvious, even to such an … unspectacular intellect as yours?
WATER ORF A DUCK’S BACK, BABY! 😅

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9.27
So you do, after all the self-conscious self-justfying crap you spouted, judge me on grammar, etc.
Jeez! Right over your tiny head. 😅

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8.02

Actually, back in the day I was rather a lazy sod. Didn’t want to excel academically, because that would have landed me a lecturer’s post at that shithole, Maynooth seminary.

I wanted to work in a parish.

Need I say that I had a highly idealised notion of Romanist priesthood, and it wasn’t until sems started to hit on me, sexually, that the penny dropped and I packed it in.

No, I wasn’t given the boot: I left of my own accord, because I began to see that Romanist priesthood, and the institutional Church, was morally an open, stagnant sewer.

Best decision of my life, leaving that cesspool.

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8.16: You would have continued with your highly idealised notion of Romanist Priesthood were you not thrown out or flung out or asked to leave the seminary. TRUTH. You can rewrite the story all you like but you were found to be unsuitable. Fact. You are the very type that had you been ordained, you’d be so p****d drunk that you’d be a lazy, self absorbed narcissist, expecting your colleagues to cover for you. If you were so wonderful in Maynooth, produce your reports as Pat did sime weeks ago to validating that he was looked upon very favourably and with respect in every way. Your report would indeed be interesting. Instead of always being on the defensive, be honest with yourself. Have real moral courage. You have now created your own stagnant sewer from which, sadly, you spew at everyone.

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Magna you were not special. They gave you an ultimatum in Maynooth – leave on you own accord or they will ask you to leave which would bar you from seminary for life. Stop pretending like you an epiphany about the priesthood. You were an arrogant little twat with no pastoral skills – ‘I wanted to work in a parish’ 😂. Go and read your reports from your summer placement the people complained about you.

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That’s it indeed, I had you down as prospective faculty! Now I understand how you know how to send up the send ups.

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8.27
Prove that I was found to be unsuitable for priesthood.
Or are you, Romanist, typical of your kind?
A liar?😕

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Pat I remember yourself and Michael Keane protesting outside the gates when we were inside. One bishop remarked that the problem with Fr Keane was that he was a man of independent means from an early age – I believe he meant that he had his own house- and so was not subject to the totsl control by his bishop. Every diocesan should aim yo buy a house of his own as soon as he’s ordained if not before.

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I knew an “element” – in a parallel universe from the actual bishops and dioceses – that would talk priestly candidates into giving away properties before “giving their all to their Overlord” so it’s not the apparent bosses that get control, someone low-profile gets in there first.

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Michael Keane inherited a large fortune. The Arch of Tuam promised him a mitre in return for the money. Keane refused. The rest is history.

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You mean… You mean… Bishoprics can be bought rather than purely given under the Holy Spirit’s inspiration?
Next you’ll be saying sexual favours can get you a mitre 🤢

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8.48

Seriously?

Is that why the poor man was suspended from ministry?

Did Neary suspend him?

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BP 8.48pm
Seriously?? Thought you were joking.
No wonder bishops obsessed with money. With the pandemic going on along with churches closed with no monies, what does it say about church future cos bishops closed off without consulting us? So much for the sermon loaded word such as ‘community’. Its an abstraction.
Remembered the nuns were after rich families as I was puzzled at v young age. That makes sense re Bishop and Fr Keane.

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It was Dermot Ryan who suspended him was it?
Did any of the bishops get monies from Fr Keane after he passed away? just asking cos mention of wealth?
Who was that Bishop who asked Keane money in return for a bishopric position?

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9.33: Magna was asked to leave but was forced, pushed to the gate. He wouldn’t have the guts or courage to print his report card. It makes very unpleasant reading. He lived then in a world of his own, arrogant and selfish and does the same today. He despaeately wantedcto work in a parish – poor fool was flipped out. Now he’s a permanently raging victim.

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