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ARCHBISHOP MC QUAID ABUSE ALLEGATIONS.

Irish Archbishop Who Died in ’73 Is Linked to Abuse

New York Times 2011

DUBLIN — The former archbishop of Dublin, John Charles McQuaid, widely regarded as the most powerful Catholic prelate in modern Irish history, stands accused of serial child sexual abuse, The Irish Times newspaper said Thursday.

Two specific complaints and a separate unspecified “concern” against an unidentified cleric were reported to the Murphy Commission, a state-sponsored investigation into the handling of clerical sexual abuse of children in the Dublin archdiocese. The newspaper reported that Archbishop McQuaid, who retired in 1972 and died a year later, was the unidentified cleric.

The commission published its main report in 2009, but it said that “due to human error” the latest allegations emerged only in a supplementary report published in July. This does not name Archbishop McQuaid, but the newspaper is adamant that the allegations of abuse contained within it refer to the archbishop. One allegation is regarding abuse of a 12-year-old boy in 1961.

“The supplementary report records that in June/July 2009, as the commission was completing its main report, it received information which would have ‘brought another cleric’ within its remit,” Patsy McGarry, the newspaper’s religious affairs correspondent, said in an interview. The archdiocese “found a letter ‘which showed that there was an awareness among a number of people in the archdiocese that there had been a concern expressed about this cleric in 1999,’ the report states. The ‘cleric’ is Archbishop McQuaid.”

The main body of the Murphy report was highly critical of Archbishop McQuaid’s attitude toward abuse, accusing him of showing “no concern for the welfare of children.” However, this is the first suggestion that the official body had received specific complaints against Archbishop McQuaid, who was at the very apex of the Roman Catholic Church in Ireland for three decades.

In a statement, a victims’ group, One in Four, called for a statutory inquiry into the accusations, saying that “if Archbishop McQuaid was, as is alleged, a sex offender himself, then it is no wonder that the secrecy and cover-ups which have characterized the church’s handling of sexual abuse was so entrenched.p

The archdiocese told the newspaper that the police were investigating the matters dealt with in the supplementary report. There is also a separate civil action being taken against the archdiocese by one complainant.A version of this article appears in print on Dec. 9, 2011, Section A, Page 6 of the New York edition with the headline: Irish Archb

PAT SAYS

I knew MxQuaid personally and never saw or heard anything that would suggest these allegations are true.

But it does seem that Dublin found allegations of some sort and passed them on for investigation.

When John Cooney published his book on McQuaid he did hear that there were two Gardai files on the matter that had disappeared.

Cooney approached a retired Garda inspector who dealt with the matter.

The inspector closed the door in Cooney’s face.

RUMOUR – AMY MARTIN TO BE TRANSLATED TO DUNLIN ???

There is a clerical rumour going about suggesting that Amy Martin in being transferred to Dublin to replace Duarmuid Martin.

One priest said: “Amy is clearing his desk in Armagh”.

I have absolutely no knowledge of the veracity if this rumour.

There is a precedent for this when Cardinal Cullen was moved from Armagh to Dublin.

If its true is is good for Amy’s career and bad for Dublin.

Amy is as useless as tits on a bull.

129 replies on “ARCHBISHOP MC QUAID ABUSE ALLEGATIONS.”

It is disgraceful that these unfounded allegations made by that dreadful hack Cooney who says he got it from Dr. Noel Browne, who never forgave His Grace for the Mother and child debacle which he lost. There is absolutely no proof at all, malicious allegations are made all the time. It is always from the same source the liberal mods who hated the Archbishop. Cooney’s biography of Dr. McQuaid shows his dislike of his subject on every page, his claims are spurious and without foundation. Lord rest dear Archbishop McQuaid.

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The Murphy report accuses McQuaid of showing no concern whatever for the welfare of children. So the answer to your question could be ‘yes’.
Poor ‘anonymous’ Bella. And she had unequivocal faith in McQuaid’s moral probity. 😅

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10.18

Just when I thought that you couldn’t produce more risible garbage than usual, you surprise me with the drivel posted at 10.18.

Dr Noel Browne lost the debate over the Mother and Child Scheme? In the short term, yes he did. But the longer-term loser was the Romanist Church in Ireland, because working-class Catholics began to turn against their so-called ‘pastors’ after their adverse interference in health-care provision in the early fifties, slowly at first, but then with increasing speed to the point where we are at today: absolute indiffernce on the part of most Irish Catholics.

Just a few years after his betrayal of the poor in Ireland through his high-handed opposition to the Mother and Child Scheme, McQuaid’s ‘authority’ was exposed for its declining relevance when the vast majority of Catholics ignored his arrogant attempt to prohibit their attending a football friendly between Ireland and Yugoslavia, a communist country. In effect, these people raised two fingers to this interfering, theocratic hypocrite and made plain their attitude to his, and other bishops’, part in denying free medical treatment to those in Ireland least able to afford it.

Very few in Ireland now give a damn about the moral teaching of the Romanist Church. With the exception of deferentially uncritical fools, like you.

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Pat, is MC officially allowed to comment again? Very bad news if he is. The blog is better without him.

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MCs comments under his MC tag are not being published.

I can’t block anonymous comments because I think its him, can I?

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Dear Pat, Paisley’s “rampant seminarian” is back on Facebook. There are many people enraged by this and some clergy in his diocese are unhappy about him being able to continue to Rome! +Keenan is sticking by him through all of this.

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Heya Hun,

It is clear from these comments that you are the same disgruntled bitchy person. Did he turn you down? Are you jealous of his good looks? Are you over the hill? Did he steal your priest boyfriends? Do tell.

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The comments are made by a lunatic who applied to be a sem for Paisley diocese, and thanks be to the living God they rejected his application. The people have been saved much suffering.

It’s awful that Pat allows such cyber-stalking and bullying.

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DID MATCH TAKE PLACE?

In the run-up to the soccer World Cup of 2002 the bust-up between Ireland manager Mick McCarthy and star player Roy Keane in Saipan caused a huge controversy and divided the nation. This was not the first time that the ‘beautiful game’ caused upheaval in Irish society. Back in the 1950s the ‘garrison town game’ set church and state and people at loggerheads with each other.
In 1952 Ireland and Yugoslavia were scheduled to meet in a friendly soccer match in Dalymount Park, Dublin. But one of the most influential and dominant Catholic Church figures in Ireland at the time, Archbishop John Charles McQuaid, had other ideas. McQuaid did not want Ireland to play a ‘Godless country’. He was, like many others, virulently anti-communist. The Cold War was in full spate. Archbishop McQuaid weighed in with his considerable power to get the match stopped. He successfully lobbied the Football Association of Ireland to have the invitation to Yugoslavia withdrawn. FAI officials capitulated very easily. McQuaid had also sent out feelers about his objections to the politicians of the time. The Cold War anti-communist line was an easy sell in the Ireland of the early 1950s. Pupils in national schools around the country prayed for ‘the conversion of Russia’ each day. The match did not take place. McQuaid got his way

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11.45
My source for the football match’s taking place is an article by Rhona McCord, titled ‘The Mother and Child Scheme – The role of Church and State.
McCord implies that the match took place by the following words:
‘Four years later, when Archbishop McWuaid ordered his flock not to attend a friendky football match between Ireland and Yugoslavia at Dalymount Park, he was largely ignored.’

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Amy was in Dublin doing a diaconate ordination, at Adam & Eve’s for the OFMs. I’ve never known him come to Dublin to do that. No wonder tongues are wagging.

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Among the striking things about the ex-PP of Pomeroy, who accidently during a First Holy Communion class popped up gay porn that he’d stored on a memory stick are the fact that he used a hammer to smash the memory stick to stop it being searched; a laptop went missing, allegedly stolen, conveniently before the police were going to collect it; gombeens stood up to applaud him when he visited the church, to the disgust of the parents of the children affected; and after all that he was made PP of Clogherhead when he should have been forcibly laicised.

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Perhaps +Dr Turtle will assume a duel role, Bp Pat, and mince back and forward between Dublin and Armagh. I wonder what Leo thinks of the grade A mincer? Not much, I imagine.

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“Mystery as ‘Cursed’ doll with evil sign nailed to its chest hung from tree [on site of St Oswald’s Roman Catholic school in Old Swan, Liverpool. Next to the church… [Sic].”
https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/mystery-cursed-doll-evil-sign-18898754
——–
“… One letter that took issue with criminologist Keith Andrews’s claims of a systematic massacre of Irish immigrants at the site in around 1848 was written by Liverpool’s former principal environmental health officer, Ken Williams, who was in charge of the 1973 exhumation [at St Oswald’s RC Church in Old Swan].”
https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/local-news/i-gave-order-burn-bodies-3520472

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Why is it that so many clergy are not sufficiently manly and robust ? People like + Martin of Armagh, and even the late McQuaid of Dublin. Prissy, OCD, prickly, precise…..etc. etc… There is something about the clerical career that attracts men of femininity and softness. Sometimes it goes along with sexual orientation – often intact – but not always. I think it has to do with emotional and psychological profiles which seem to be attracted to a life that has boundaries and certainties. Many of these men are not able to deal with nuance, grey areas, flexibility, adaptability etc. etc. It’s a very odd and strange dynamic.

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And it was never intended by Christ. The history of clergy, and clericalism, in the Church confirms this, because these men hsve done tremendous damage historically to the Church and to people’s faith.

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9.33: I presume you include effem Buckkey in your summation of clerics….of course there are exceptions: You haven’t met me!!! A huge hunky alpha male!! Give me your number….

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The 12-year-old boy alledgedly fiddled with by McQuaid reported the incident to his father, a publican. The account of the matter that I read said that the boy’s father believed his son and then privately threatened McQuaid.

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12.29
You don’t know where I read it.
How do you know that Cooney couldn’t name the publican? Can you prove that he couldn’t do so?
According to the account I read (and it categorically was not by Cooney), the matter was dealt with firmly by the publican, but IN PRIVATE. So presumably, he did not want his name disclosed.
An unsubstantiated allegation is not necessarily an untrue one. You, however, cavalierly dismissed, out of hand, ALL such allegations against McQuaid. And yet, you have the temerity to dismiss Cooney’s reporting on the matter?
Unbelievable.

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And that does not explain the two complaints on the file in archbishops house and the two missing Gardai files?

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Pat. I understand that there are three dark horses in the running for appointment as next Archbishop of Dublin. Two are priest and the third is a Bishop working inRome but not from Dublin. Anyway the two priests to lookout for are Fr. Martin Harte and Fr Gregory O Brien. The others who were in the running O’Carroll, McDermott, and Mullen where rejected by Rome in May for what are termed “intellectual” reasons.

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Haven’t heard of Fr. Martin Harte, did he lecture in the theology faculty in Trinity? Fr Gregory would be too much like the present Archbishop, he’s almost a clone of him. Maybe that’s what we need.

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Yes Fr. Gregory is a clone of DM, that wee letter was written by another hand. Surely you knew that like the Archbishop, Gregory isn’t the brightest star in the heavens both are dim. So yes Fr. Gregory would be a clone of the Archbishop. As one would here them say in Paris “l’un est une image miroir de l’autre, il est difficile de faire la différence”

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At 10:59am – you are definitely a wind up merchant! 😂
Gregory O’Brien??? 😂😂😂
Mullen and the other two rejected for “intellectual reasons”?? 🤣🤣🤣
Good one! Well done 🤣😂😂🤠👏

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1:02pm
The penny’s finally dropped its you Polly how could I not have known, I see you still hate me as much as evern. Never mind I will say The Memorare for you as usual, hope you’re well and off the gargle but something I don’t think so.

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MC QUAID AND FIRST YEAR SEMINARIANS
McQuaid interviewed every first year seminarian at Clonliffe and spoke to them about sex and advised them all about pulling back the foreskin and washing underneath etc. He also spoke about the facts of life, masturbation, erections wet dreams etc.
A bit like Paul Prior I suppose. And they were both Cavan men.

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I think it is commendable that the Archbishop had the maturity to address such topics with seminarians. Did he address these topics with you Pat? How did you personally find him? An article from your personal experience would be appreciated.

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He did address these topics with me. I was very immature at 18 and was embarrassed.

Personally I found him friendly and kind.

I have no personal knowledge of him overstepping boundaries.

I had the impression that he was sexually repressed – something many Catholics were st that time.

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11.16

Commendable? I’m almost at a loss for words.

It was prurience; nothing more.

Why didn’t he address them on kindness, patience, mercy, forgiveness, forbearance, etc. ?These are much more important than having a wank.

Sex: the biggest hang-up of the Catholic Church. And inevitably and ultimately, its undoing.

Perhaps if these clerical perverts had thought less of, and about, sex, they wouldn’t have steered themselves into moral and criminal deviancy.

We become what we think of most, and most of.

I do hope that you aren’t a priest (though I strongly suspect you are) in charge of young people. And if you talk to them about such matters (and I suspect you would, given your praise of McQuaid), I hope they tell you where to go, and then phone the police.

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12:29
He is a saint. He gave those young men practical life advice. Get your head out of the gutter.

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1.00

No matter how hard you try, Bella, you just cannot hide your spirit.

You are infinitely worse than Cooney, the journalist you dismissed pejoratively as a ‘hack’.

You are also a moral coward, since you don’t want even to consider that these extremely serious allegations against McQuaid may actually be true.

You are one of those who would happily have protected paedophile rapists among RC priests, and who would, therefore, have condemned other children to abuse in the future at their vile, criminal hands.

I honestly don’t know which is morally worse: these revolting priests, or spineless, deferential apologists for them, odious people like you.

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1:00pm

No matter how hard you try you cannot hide your hatred, allegations are what they are allegations there is no proof any them are true. You and your likes just want to believe anything against Church or Her servants. You are right in saying I will never believe any of that trash about Dr. McQuaid I never will because they are not true. Where you are wrong I would never ever protect any cleric or anyone I knew to be guilty of abuse I would be the first one to ensure that they were punished severely by the Ecclesiastical Authority’s and the Civil Authorities. Its strange to feel such hatred from a stranger but I suppose its only natural coming from such an evil odious creature like you .

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2.34

Bella, dear, have a care that you don’t shoot yourself in the other foot as well.

The post you intended to address is at 1.43, not at 1.00. The latter is, in fact, you.

Bella, you are attacking…yourself.😅

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At 12.06, I was a Royal Marine and no such talk on masturbation, erections, wet dreams, and the rest, is given to recruits. There is a demonstration, by a corporal in the shower, of how marines are expected to attend to personal hygiene, but that is all. There is very little to compare between this, and the talk by that archbishop.

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11.06

He pontificated, largely to 18-year-old boys, on his own, sexual bugbears.

When men are obsessed with such matters, they become a prey to them.

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2:46pm

Wrong again you cretin 1:00pm is not me you seem to have such a hatred of me that your seeing things that are not true. Never mind dear I forgive you, God bless the mark.

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I can’t ever imagine +Amy Turtle ever broaching the subject of… well, let’s just say, foreskins on toast with her young seminarians (if any).

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What an extraordinary conversation with the archbishop that must have been? Im not surprised you were embarrassed by such a concentration of sexual information at a first meeting. Like most Irish boys and girls of an older generation, I learned about the ‘facts of life’ at the back of the bicycle shed and if my informant had mentioned atomically details like the ‘foreskin’ he would have lost me completely. Later, I learned that not just one of Christ’s ’ foreskins, but four of them, were to be found enshrined in gold and gem encrusted receptacles in Catholic cathedrals of Germany, which was either a miracle, a biological wonder, or a failure in the understanding of the saints and scholars.

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Who in their right mind would speak to young fellas about such things? It seems JC McQ was an old perv after all. What’s the difference between him and Paulie the Pry-er?

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I have no idea, but I would love to know. They used to publish Clergy Appointments/Moves in Westminster Record each September. Now it is kept secret. We have to trawl online parish newsletters to piece together the moves. It’s puzzling why they want to hide them!

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Surely all of Pat’s Westminster clergy correspondents could send him the list (or just publish it here)?

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Who is on the move?
I guess they are preparing Bishop John to be caretaker Archbishop until Elsie’s replacement is named. Are Bunty and Boring Marcus still the favourites? Arthur may be too old.

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12.29: Take a chill pill and calm down with your hate rant against clerics. I trust you are a parent….just winder what kind of bigoted kids you raise. Probably all twisted precious gems…

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1.53: You are so wrong, you fool. Not Bella….your brain seems stuck up your back side. Try to be intelligent. You are a priest hater: A bigot.

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PROFESSOR GERARD GILLEN

CONTRARY TO AN EARLIER COMMENT PROFESSOR GILLEN, IS THANK GOD VERY MUCH ALIVE AND WELL.

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Mgr Francis Cremin, for years a professor of moral theology in Maynooth, and widely considered to be a reactionary in the later, depraved Maynooth, had been a supporter and adviser to Noel Browne on the mother and child scheme. Archbishop McQuaid’s opposition to it seems as irrational as the opposition in the US to government healthcare.

By a twist of history, Cremin went on to accompany the Archbishop to Vatican II as his peritus.

I never knew that the Archbishop hailed from Cavan, a county that has blessed us with three great churchmen: McQuaid, Brady, and Prior.

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The Passionists used to have a house in Cootehill. If only he’d joined them instead of the Holy Ghosts he could have been the poor man’s Brian Darcy.

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Her first miracle will be to get those culchie lads around Mullagh and Cross to change their underpants more than once a month. Their mothers will be delighted.

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Not forgetting Virginia-born Bishop Michael Router, currently a lowly Auxiliary in Armagh but widely tipped to go to another Northern diocese in the next few years…….

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We actually have a recipient of the archbishop’s talk about sex here, so Pat you were young but in retrospect was it prurient?
We must not forget how less sexualised the pre sixties generations were and while that may seem bizarre, a talk about sex would have seemed less prurient.
It is also possible that he would not want prospective priests to risk being completely uneducated about these things.
I am reliably informed that the British army tell new recruits about hygiene of the foreskin and sexual health- seriously if you want people to know about these things you have to talk about them.
There is a difference between prurient questioning about fantasies and factual information giving. If you want priests to be able to cope with pastoral situations about sex you have to make sure they know about it and there is no guarantee they will have been sensibly educated, even in 2020.

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Every seminarian of Clonliffe for many years got this chat.

McQuaid asked no personal questions.

He communicated sexual information.

But I suspect, as I said, he was repressed.

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There were no such chats in Maynooth. I’m surprised that ++McQuaid did them personally. If he thought that such a conversation was necessary did Clonliffe not have an infirmarian or college doctor to do it, or even the dean?

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I commented at 5:24 and I pointed out there were no chats in Maynooth of the kind undertaken by the bishop.

I was referring only to my time there and I should have added that it was most unfortunate that Paul Prior chose to introduce such conversations.

They are alarming in that any man who was learning the facts of life for the first time in a seminary shouldn’t have been in a seminary in the first place if he was so ignorant or had had such a repressed upbringing that education on these things was required. A discussion on sexuality was either for the lecture hall or with a spiritual director.

Secondly, it is improper and prurient to go into such detail in a one-to-one conversation.

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Thank you all for several comments. I totally agree a man needing basic education should not be in a seminary – however I continue to think that a very different situation would have obtained years ago. Besides as we know the tridentine ideal of the seminary was entirely to get them young.
Trying to think of this from the archbishop’s point of view, and totally agreeing that in retrospect it wasn’t a good idea, I wonder whether a cleric of his type and time would rather have done the talks himself to ensure the seminarians were told what he considered the right line?

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That McQuaid was sexually repressed and repressive is indubitable, but his activities as archbishop were edifying in their time. He was a kind of sacred icon to many Irish Catholics. The church culture he embodied is unimaginable now.

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Jesus, Mary and St. Joseph…what perversions you all havevre: Archbishop McQuaid…Here am I, arrived in from a hard day’s work with children and a wife to care about. And you lot – mostly clerics, Pat included, can only talk about foreskin! What a lazy shower of wasters…Pat, shame, shame…but I will attend 7.30 mass in my local church followed by a St. V. de Paul meeting. My God..

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You care about your wife and children by giving them an hour of your time after work before going out again to a weekday Mass and an SVP meeting? I’d question your priorities before having a pop at others.

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7.06: Yes, I truly care for my wife and family: we all care for one another. But we also try to live real, meaningful lives of service to those who are in need, as the gospel asks of us. . Din’t you think that’s very noble? Of course not- you buffoon. Incidentally, I hope you are not a priest. What a waster…

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6.13: Pat, that’s about the most honest thing you’ve said about yourself for a long, long time. Indeed, you are not always right. No truer words. You get it badly wrong much of the time.

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4.30: You obviously don’t know anything about Gregory O Brien. He is a man of principle and does not suffer fools gladly. He stands his ground with DM, is very sincere in his opinions and expresses them very coherently. He is most definitely not a clone of DM…You utter buffoon of an idiot.

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Pat, Amy Martin is beside herself with rage that you have fond out about her going to Dublin. Talk about a conniption this morning in Ara Coeli!!! Aidan Gordon had to send to the chemist for a calming potion. She was heard out the far length of the Monaghan Road. The people thought the local cattery was in some class of an uproar.

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JC McQ’s sex talks certainly seem odd. However, there is a difference between his practice and the Pry-er in Maynooth whose “interests” and line of questioning were of much more personal nature.
John Charles simply outlined certain facts of biology and nature.
Pry-er wanted to know the “ins and outs” of individuals in relation to erections, ejaculating, etc. That is truly prurient.
I can’t believe that guy is walking into a parish. The Irish Church deserves everything it gets. It’s overseen by a combination of spineless fools and men with no principles.

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How many years has it been since you got kicked from Maynooth? Can you not move on with your life? Paul did nothing to you; the Garda laughed at you; we ALL laughed at you with your fantasies.

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7.28: Get to grips with your arrant nonsense and pre pubescent idiocy. Are you so sex starved that you depend on this blog for your fantasies? Get real. Grow up.

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McQuaid has been betrayed by his own voluminous archive-John Cooney
Mon, Apr 7, 2003.
“In the John Charles McQuaid story lies the awesome power of the Catholic Church in Ireland in the mid-twentieth century, writes John Cooney”.
“A control freak, McQuaid mobilised government Departments, Dublin Corporation, and the medical, legal and teaching professions to defend “Catholic Ireland” from the liberal wiles of The Irish Times, Trinity College, and the Communist Party. In the McQuaid story lies the awesome power exercised by the Catholic Church in Ireland in the mid-twentieth century.
McQuaid represents both the high point of Catholic power and an index by which to measure the subsequent decline of the Catholic Church’s influence in society. Like the tapes which brought down Richard Nixon’s presidency, McQuaid left too much on record in his voluminous archive that casts him in an unfavourable light. The 700 boxes of letters show how elected politicians shamefully bowed to his crusade to rid “Catholic Ireland” of dissidents, Jews and especially Protestants.
Moreover, since McQuaid’s death the stream of revelations about physical and sexual abuse by clergy in church institutions has shown that these evils were an integral part of the Catholic Church even in his day. Within the Dublin diocese, priests who served under McQuaid have been now brought before the courts and found guilty on charges of horrendous sex acts against children in church care.
Thirty years on, it is time for the present Government to order the gardaí to trawl the McQuaid archive and investigate the extent and the roots of clerical child sex abuse.
Until this is done, the McQuaid legacy will continue to haunt the Irish Catholic Church.”
See: https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/mcquaid-has-been-betrayed-by-his-own-voluminous-archive-1.354872

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Hardly, I would have thought there has been a deliberate policy of dismantling anything associated with his Catholicism, surely the last gasp must be the wayside grottos they have got to go they are offensive to a secular diverse republic all statues must be in private and the angelus should be changed to the call to Allah the merciful during Ramadan and Somewhere Over the Rainbow during gay pride month, can Ireland have a women’s pro choice month ?

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