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ST WILGEFORTIS – THE PATRON SAINT OF THE TRANS COMMUNITY – AT LEAST IN THE USA.

SAINT WILGEFORTIS

Information from his British Museum.

Legendary Christian saint and martyr, daughter of a pagan king of Portugal. Together with her brothers and sisters she became a Christian, but to resist marriage to a suitor chosen by her father she prayed to become unattractive: she grew a beard and moustache, her suitor was dissuaded and, as a result, her father had her crucified. She is also said to have rewarded a young fiddler for playing in front of her crucified body by giving him one of her golden boots, and by giving him the second boot when he was accused of stealing the first one. It is now assumed that her name is a corruption of ‘Hilge Vartz’ (‘holy face’) and is to be related to the ‘Volto Santo’ of Lucca, an early wooden effigy depicting Christ as a man wearing a long regal tunic, which was misinterpretated as a dress.

St Wilgefortis on the cross looks like Jesus in a dress and I’m sure many will find this offensive?

Mind you, the “trans” isdue is a bigger issue than ever with more and more men and women choosing to change to the other sex.

I have some experience in ministering to trans people.

Its a very controversial area with very strong views on either side.

Some people feel very strongly that scare NHS money should not be spent on trans surgery while the waiting lists on life saving other surgeries are surging.

Some are not willing to accept it is a medical condition at all.

Yet the doctors do accept it and call it gender dysphoria.

Patients have to jump through all kinds of hoops and live fully for two years as a member of the sex you want to change to.

My own approach is to listen and journey with people without judgement.

It is very hard for those of us who do not have gender dysphoria to fully understand.

What do readers think?

Saint Wilgefortis pray for us.

107 replies on “ST WILGEFORTIS – THE PATRON SAINT OF THE TRANS COMMUNITY – AT LEAST IN THE USA.”

An extremely doubtful hagiography, as credible as a Gnostic gospeI. And a lot more entertaining.
Frankly, beyond its entertainment value, it’s downright embarrassing. No wonder atheists laugh at Christianity and dismiss it’s claims as unproven and unverifiable nonsense.
I can’t claim to understand gender dysphoria, but I do know that some of those who transition surgically, either in whole or part, come to regret doing so. Deeply.
Just recently, I watched part of a 60 Minutes documentary from Australia on a teenaged biological boy who partly transitioned through breast augmentation, but who then decided that he was really a boy after all, not a girl. His mother is now seeking breast-reduction surgery for the boy. He may not be typical of such people, but his like is not statistically insignificant either.
Doctors, especially (but not only) inexperienced ones, can be too quick to diagnose a person with gender dysphoria.

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If 9.09 appreciated the genre of a Gnostic Gospel she/he would have understood that credibility is not an issue. The crux is meaning. However, I appreciate that that’s not a nuance a regular reader of Wikipedia could be expected to evince.

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11.07

I don’t know why I bother; I really don’t. I suppose it must be the pure pleasure of putting the mediocre, like you, in their rightful place.

The Gnostic gospels are not incorporated in the Canon of Scripture for a reason. They don’t tell us anything even plausible about Christ, except that the authors of these passages were driven more by the fantastical side of human imagination than the intellectual integrity of corroborative sources.

Scholars are unanimous, however, that these gospels are valuable sources for information about the authors themselves and the communities in which some of them lived.

But not about Christ.

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MC 9:09 “decided that he was really a boy after all”.
People have a biological sex at birth. It influences medical treatment. When people are of the age of consent, let them identify freely to the gender they associate with.
Physicians will always require detail of sex at birth but that can be a private and discreet matter.

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12.15

Do you just string together words that randomly come to mind, hoping that the sentences will seem coherent anyhow? Your muddled post suggests as much. And it isn’t the first such post on this blog.

Listen, if you really are not well, I apologise for my off-handedness; but if you are a troll, then you can …. off!

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MC 12:48,
I merely highlighted the importance of documenting biological sex at birth. While it might not have been your intention at 9:09, you did open the door for that important point as part of today’s discussion.

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1.20

I see.

But wasnt that stating the obvious? The biological sex of any trans-person will always be a matter of medical record. It rather defeats the arguments in favour of at least surgical transitioning, doesn’t it?Or does it?

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2.28

Even if the proponents of post-natal gender non-assignment were to have their fatuous way, biological sex will always be determinable (Drop your pants, please.) and will remain a baseline for selective medical treatment.There is no getting around (and certainly no getting away) from telltale genitalia.

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MC 1:37, for you, something might be a matter of record.
There has been discussion in some quarters of possibly not assigning a new born baby a gender. I think that is going too far.
I have firstly set in place the importance of sex at birth, lest there be any doubt.
Secondly, I seek to set out for discussion that the age of consent or after is time enough to allow someone identify their gender should they so wish.

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Pat at 2:54 I knew someone in exactly this situation. She was assigned female after birth, however it was a source of endless trouble to her. She was fully aware that people assumed she was a man because of her appearance but the worst thing that happened to her was at one point she was raped and the police wouldn’t proceed with it because of having both sets of genitals at birth. She told me, and I have no idea of the law now or then, that in law she was considered a man and couldn’t be raped.
This sounds bizarre but up until the nineties in the UK it was legally impossible for a husband to rape his wife.
I will confess to an automatic reaction at this point which I know is wrong and surprises me that given the above it would be better to be assigned male. That reaction actually surprises me.
I can’t remember why my friend was assigned female.

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2.54
That, granted, is a problem; poor souls. But don’t doctors normally make a decision, in consultation with the parents of inter-sex children, to assign a gender in these cases? To help avoid future anguish over indeterminate sex?
Some years ago, right-wing religious fanatics in Australia objected to this kind of intervention, on the incredibly presumptive ground that God wills inter-sex births.
Then again, the RCC once objected to pain relief for women in labour on the ground that it contradicted God’s part-punishment for the joint sin of Adam and Eve (that a woman should give birth ‘in travail’) and to smallpox innoculation for a similar reason.
How religion expands the mind! (And fills the pockets of its ministers.😕)

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Magna you’re absolutely right that it should be medical people advising parents because they are likely to have the knowledge of how the child’s physical status will affect their life in the future. Since a newborn child is obviously too young to decide and legally can’t for years, I would feel for parents having to make that decision. The morals of this lie in that decision and in the effect on the person’s life rather than in any abstract religious idea.
Does God will people to be born intersex – is a moot point if their life is ruined by, say, urine infections.

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Magna, it is indeed little wonder that atheists, like myself, dismiss the claims of Christianity as unproven and unverifiable nonsense. I have to laugh at the bizarre nature of those beliefs, though not in a personal way at the individuals holding those beliefs.
Let me spell out just one central belief of Catholic priests that I find utterly ridiculous.

“As a Roman Catholic priest, I have the power to turn this bread wafer and portion of wine into the body and blood of a dead Jew who lived 2000+ years ago. Moreover and significantly, that Jew was God, the Creator of this earth, and the millions of other galaxies with their stars and planets now scientifically known to exist.
” My power to do this comes from having been ‘ontologically changed and empowered’ through an ordination ceremony by a bishop who has been similarly ordained then promoted by other bishops in a church which claims to have been founded by that dead Jew.
“It really doesn’t matter how well I live my life for when I say those consecration words, God, the universe’s creator is immediately summoned to become present in this bread and wine.”
etc, etc etc.
At one time I had respect for religion. The more I’ve learned, that former childhood inculcated deference has waned. In point of fact it requires effort to achieve fine balance between questioning or ridiculing bizarre incoherent religious faith beliefs while still showing respect for an individual’s freedom of choice/belief. One has to dissent sufficiently strongly while still showing respect for the individual to avoid it being misinterpreted as deference or agreement with their faith beliefs.
MMM

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7.53
I’m sure you’ll agree that Blaise Pascal was a little more learned than you. (Remember the time you decried the education you received in Ireland?)
Ergo, you might consider Pascal’s (who didn’t have to labour under the weight of early education deprivation that you did) wager as being a little more enlightened than your summary above.

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MMM, I admit, in respect of romanist priests, that I’m tempted to walk your path.
I DESPISE these parasites, spongers, scroungers, and moochers; and had I a broom wide enough, and the strength commensurate to the task, I should sweep every last one of these useless beings off the planet.

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Perhaps Magna, like myself, you might agree with the humanitarian principles espoused by the person of Christ as promoted in the New Testament, irrespective of whether or not there is any historical veracity in either the existence of Christ, the Gospels account of his life, and in particular the proposition that he was a Messianic God, the creator of the universe.
What serves us all best is that central message and essence of cooperation, kindness and consideration. It is an evolutionary development over countless millennia, and now hijacked by religious self serving organisations interposing their ministrations as the sole conduit of relationship with an imaginary God and promise of beneficial afterlife.
MMM

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Even if ‘St Wilgerfortis’ existed in strict accordance with that apocryphal hagiography, she wasn’t transgender; she was more one of those ‘bearded ladies’ that featured in the Victorian circus.

So what on earth rational connection has she with America’s trans-community?

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@11.02am That is correct but much deeper questions are raised by this blog. It is the relationship between sex and gender; is it ‘natural’ to be born into one sex and to choose another? These are the questions that are fundamental

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Or, can one have the genitalia of one gender and be fundamentally the other gender?

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By Post Author

12:52; “Is it ‘natural’ to be born into one sex and to choose another?”
12:54; “Or, can one have the genitalia of one gender and be fundamentally the other gender?”
These people feel trapped in their bodies. They seem to testify that the answer to both questions is – yes.
Gender dysphoria is not a mental illness though. The problem is that some people develop mental health problems because of their gender dysphoria.
I don’t agree with public money being spent on the procedure. I have sympathy for the people. They have their free will.
If there was no possibility of a surgical procedure, society should look at it as what can they do to ensure people are comfortable with who they are, in an environment that does not create or lead to mental health problems.

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11.02

Now THAT’S a coherent post. What’s more, I agree with it. Well, largely.

Everyone should indeed be welcomed. But in respect of the gender they associate with? This I am not so sure of, and my reservation here is partly justified by the experience of the teenaged biological boy I mentioned in my post at 9.09am.

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The whole politicization and sexualusation of LBGTQI is confusing many children and young people. The medical procedures engaged in have often caused more trauma than expected. The aggressive ideology behind LBGTQI is a fight back against an authoritarian regime of morality which restricted people in sexual freedoms. Much of that was very wrong and an abuse. But now we are at the other extreme where there are no moral boundaries, where anything we want and any gender or non gender we want to be, are granted to those who advocate for such medical needs. Surely we shoukd not experiment with 3/4/5/6 year olds about their gender! The gay christian community must be welcomed to churches, must be included and acknowledged. I have difficulty with the sub culture if the gay world and having witnessed the enormous struggles of a married friend who was transitioning to be a woman, I think this reality needs further careful and professional study. I have watched many videos of people who regret the gender/sexuality change they signed up to. The undoing of surgery and chemical induced physiological changes are almost impossible and inflict huge new traumas. We must not present sexual identity to children or young people as something we can change or choose easily.

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At 13.20pm, out of 11 comnents, Magna has 5, SeamusV111 has 2: ….Another day of take over by Marge but the usual ad nauseam repeat stuff…

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1:23 pm Yes, I agree that this person, Magna, has too high an opinion of him/herself. A little humility would do no harm. A little less arrogance would improve the situation. And a little more knowledge would do the world of good. Others could follow such reform, enhancing this blog.

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Yes, the arrogant, entitled priests who comment here could take your advice. The reason for the dearth of comments from them today is the subject isn’t about them.

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inappropriate photos. Jesus is who he is and does not need a dress to make a point. This reflects human insecurity rather than a statement on Jesus inner understandings or attitudes.
I saw a union jack with a rainbow on it recently-Is this really necessary

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2.17: There is a dearth of respinse also from the usual non clerical suspects here every day. The arrogant, entitled priests do not exist but in your hate filled disdain. Your ilk are so jaundiced, so spiritually and morally blind that you never notice the big plank in your own eye. Also, the reason for so few comments today is that the topic is considered “boring” by all who prefer bitch fests not debate. The “trans” stuff is boring…basically.

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3.20, the arrogant entitled priests do not exist?😅
I suppose the ones that raped children don’t exist either.

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My own first thought about transgender people is that I don’t get it so think I should listen to them. I have talked to both sides, including people who changed their mind after gender reassignment surgery.
The coat with long sleeves of Joseph is an interesting appearance of a boy being treated as a girl in the bible and can totally be read in gender terms which would explain his brothers’ hatred.

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Glad that I’m weaning off from this blog 😘.
There is another gender in Thailand – 3rd sex. I found out when I was touring far Asia.

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The anonymous parishioners that posted to pat recently highlighting corruption in ennis, for the second time, can I get a copy please, to contact me, thanks!

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Thank the Lord it is no longer acceptable to gender neutral to call people “Guys”. A pet hate of mine and terrible Americanism. Sloppy language.

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@1:23 pm and @2:06
+ Pat, I do think you need to be much more rigorous with the blog. You provide an important forum for priests and religious to bring into the public domain information that would otherwise remain occult. Because you have a demonstrable track record of being protective of your sources that is why you are trusted. You are an ecclesiastical WikiLeaks for the British Isles. This needs to continue, but you need to be much more focused and you need to moderate the blog with greater rigour.
Too often the blog is hijacked by the inane commentary of Magna and others spewing out nonsense. As a priest, I would not give you any information, because I would not want it demeaned by pettiness and the cynicism that is dripping from the commentariat. The blog has served a very useful purpose in the past. It has become a victim of its own success. And if you do not do something about it the blog will cease to have traction as this never ending mindless commentary and bitching is eroding its standing to the glee of the bishops.
Let me tell you what has stood out recently on the blog: the significant donations received by the Diocese of Ossory, your focus on Fr. Jones in Kerry (he should never have been ordained) and Fr. Fitzgerald in Killaloe (his sexual antics are mind blowing), the Silverstream scandal, and the subtle but persuasive attempts to expose Richard Purcell at Mount Melleray Abbey. Your recent letter to the Papal Nuncio about Eamon Fitzgerald was just outstanding. Of course you must not traduce anybody’s good name but only make allegations that are provable. The financial misfeasance of bishops and the profligacy associated with their vanity projects is a rich seam to be mined.
You need to make the blog more professional. You need to moderate more rigorously. Nobody wants to read bullshit. If someone vehemently disagrees with you and produces an intelligent argument then it should be posted.
Your posting about the sale of land in the Diocese of Meath and some of the commentary was excellent. More of this kind of blogging, please.

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Ah! But Father does know best.

Father is always right, even when he writes the greatest load of self-serving bollox.😅

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Since ‘father’ wants a safe space for priests and religious perhaps he should set one up, since nobody else is interested in what he has to say.

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I read a letter to a priest once in one of the Catholic papers, it was a sort of agony priest page. The man said that his wife was performing oral sex on him and wanted to know if this was OK. The priest told him that it was as long as he only ejaculated in the vagina.
There was no reference to the woman’s sexual pleasure at all.
What a fool to ask a priest what he could do with his wife. I hope she has long since divorced him and moved on to someone sensible.

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Yvonne Drake
Get on with your life as everyone else has moved on except you.
Treat it as an experience one of Hope, Love and charity.
I understand you are not even a member of the RCC however I may stand corrected on that.
There is always something over the rainbow Yvonne so follow that dream.

Who knows what the future holds for you and Ger that is up to your hearts.
As trying for scandal in Ennis there is NONE and new clergy have been appointed.
Even the Diocesan Secretary is going to be based in Cloughleigh.

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Father Blogs and web sites cost a lot of money they are not cheap.
Bishop Pat pays for this blog himself and all the costs.
Bishop Pat does not get a Diocesan Salary as he is independent at the Oratory Society.
So be Grateful for the time consuming work that Bishop Pat does for the blog and more so helps the RCC get rid of the falling clergy.

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Not necessarily. Anyone can set up one for free using blogger or WordPress without the fee Pat pays.
As Pat found, blogger have a policy where they shut your blog down after a certain number of complaints. You can however make the blog only open to people invited if you don’t want it to be public.
You can also do the same with a Facebook group.
However of course if you want it to be public and are using it to reveal things others don’t want known you will run the gauntlet of libel laws, etc.

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4.25: Yvonne, if it is you, this blog is not the forum for your grievances to be aired. Have some self respect.

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With all do respect….

Mind your own business, you haven’t a clue and with all do respect….

Fuck off!!

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5.18: Yvonne, you’ll fall into a deeper pit…where’s your dignity and self respect with that kind of un-girlie language!!

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5.18: Now, now Yvonne: the word is “DUE” and telling someone to f**k off tells me you didn’t get a good Convent education.. You should close your mouth and the other “openings” in your body when you hang loose with men!!! You ain’t a lady..

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I’m sure they would be happy for me to have it, once again I will request it and if you won’t provide it. I hope they see these comments and forward it on.

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Yvonne Bishop Pat is NOT going to give you personal correspondence to him,
The people of Ennis are not blind or stupid.
Everyone in Ennis and Killaloe Dioceses can see the full situation so move on with your life.
Yvonne when people see you they can see the True Yvonne.
So seek Professional help to assist you to move forward out of your darken slumber.
From a Church view Ger Fitzgerald issues will be addressed inhouse and most likely through a Canonical procedure.
You can read from the Clergy changes NO mention of Ger Fitzgerald even as on a sabbatical so he is looking to his future hopefully outside the presbyterate.

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@4:56 P.M. maybe after asking the Priest he moved on and asked a Bishop or wow wait. Imagine if he asked a Cardinal.

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I for one don’t care about Yvonne or Ger. it was boring when it was exposed and it’s boring now.

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If I let it up to the diocese, other people and trusted in the process, I would of been fucked…

And that’s the truth and reality….

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Ha ha ha I enjoyed the post about ‘Catholic oral sex’
Any orifice is OK as long as end game is ejaculating in the right one!!
Jeez that moral theology class would have been fun.
Thing is it’s all about the ‘naked intent’ that’s two words not three.
Problem with the right orifice is what happens if wifey is a bloody fantastic cunning ljnguist and especially tight in the office around the back that dare not speak its name and suddenly it’s game over and what is it – venial mortal or just plain old delicious sin and so pleasurable you’d even go to hell to experience that again!!
Ha ha ha imagine talking to a seminary virgin about this – it would feel wrong like giving sex education to a ten year old.

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GER FITZGERALD AND YVONNE

Ms Drake, if it wasn’t for Bishop Buckley and his powerful blog Ger Fitzgerald would be still the incumbent of Cloughleigh working alongside his lieutenant Tina. You’ve got Ger’s head on a plate now so grow up and get on with your life. Its not the first time a woman was spurned and it won’t be the last.

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I agree KP. Yvonne had problems before she met Ger but him getting between her thighs deepened her problems. She has been hanging around since partying with dead beats and their alcohol and substances. She needs professional help.

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KP and ENNIS JENNY you are both trying to shift the blame onto Yvonne. Fitzgerald chased her not the other way around. Stop excusing clerical misbehaviour.

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I am a faithful reader of this blog, and I appreciate greatly what Bishop Pat does in exposing corruption in the Church. It is extremely important work. The RCC, particularly in Ireland, is clearly unable to monitor and reform itself. The shepherds far too often turn out to be hirelings, and even worse, the very wolves themselves.

That being said, I find myself in sympathy with the comment “Improving the Blog”. Of course, I understand that not every post can be a hard-hitting exposé. However, I would strongly encourage Bishop Pat to take some sort of measures to ensure that the comboxes here do not collapse daily (as they seem to now) into “The Magna and Seamus Show”.

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FR 6:11,
Some comment makers get their socks in a twist. Some comment makers get their knickers in a twist. I do not judge you. May you live in peace in respect of the gender you identify with.
PAX

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And expect Bishop Pat to do their dirty work for them because they don’t have the balls to call the bishops out or go public themselves.
Everything Magna Carta says about these pathetic snake oil salesmen is true.

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😂 Oh please. Not “buttering up” but establishing why the good the blog does is obscured by the now daily circus sideshow. Also, why assume that I’m a priest?

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Because you’re trying to silence voices that dissent from your own view and won’t do what Pat does, yourself.
You’ve got priest written all over you.

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@ 7.58)
No marks for guessing the (pesudonymous identity of the author of this comment which purports to vindicate him. (I presume it’s a he if he was asked to leave the seminary.)

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Okolo I hear feels threatened by you and your blog Buckley. What has he to fear? I hear he wants Francis to get him out and soon. He has been useless and mishandled a case in Raphoe we haven’t heard about yet from years ago.

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Bishop Pat,
Archbishop Jude is suppose to be moving after Easter.
Everything now is dependant on Pope Francis and his health.
It seems there will be new Cardinals appointed late September early October.
Roman Curia usually takes their holidays in August and will be back 6th September.

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Okolo has been as much use as an ashtray on a moterbike. An old Cliche I know but true. He and Eamon are hand in glove. Rome (Francis) is tiring of Okolo and Martin.

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8.00: Faithful Reader: You are so right about the content of this blog – a side show of a circus frequently. Be prepared for a barrage of nasty attacks because you dared offer a different view than the tone of the daily “vomnentary”..Be prepared – and if you are a priest, you will be mangled. Mind yourself on this blog.

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As +Pat says it is difficult to understand gender dysphoria for those of us who don’t experience it. I have been aquinted with two people who were in different stages of their journey with it. I could certainly empathise with their hurt and frustration in the face of misunderstanding and even sometimes cruelty. Jesus is the “Way” and St Paul tells us that he is the “yes” of God’s promises. Isn’t it far better to affirm them in moving forward with life than to allow them to languish in the sense of limitedness. All too often we are quick to pronounce negatively on the situation of others and their choices, I wonder if we ever consider that in so doing we might be at odds with God himself.

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The Catholic Church doesn’t treat homosexuals with any dignity (refusing to bless) do you honestly think respecting a transgender or transvestite person with dignity or compassion is going to happen any time soon.

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8.05
They have been busy today reminding us all of CCC 2357.
very sad indeed more so when Pope Francis said who are I to judge.

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Didn’t the man who ran the Catholic Bible School transition to a woman – and self identified – never mentioned again although he/she founded the whole thing.
He was a scripture scholar me thinks but I’m sure was dropped like a stone cold brick.

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There must be clergy – out of the 400,000 in the world who want to transition – imagine the theological nuclear bomb if Fr Steve became Eve!!

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Pat your blog functions as a safe space for those abused by priests and here they are trying to take over.

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Interestingly, after I was abused, and some, this blog was great for my healing process –still is. But my abusers came after me on this blog, to to try and silence me even more. That backfired—-massively!
Good bye, the +Banes, of my life!
… As previously stated: Always start right at the very top—-then work your way right to the very bottom, when Spring cleaning your house.

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8.23: You are delusional. Only a handful of clerics comment on Pat’s blog. The majority of commenters are non clerics and very repetitive. If anyone is trying to take over, it’s Magna.. No priest with any dignity or self respect would be bothered attempting a coup against Pat! You are simply exaggerating.

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8:34 correct. It is obvious that the majority of comments are not from clergy. There are undoubtedly a few dim clerics who comment but the vicious and vitriolic rhetoric is from non ordained and seminary rejects like the MagnaTroll. What self respecting priest who cares about his mental health would come here to allow the venom into his mind?

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8:07 it’s the tone, the self satisfied, prissy tone, ‘father’. Also the tendency to blame everyone else and never get enough attention!

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To be fair to the much maligned Magna, he set the ball rolling on yesterday’s discussion when others were reluctant to get involved. The hurlers on the ditch love to complain. They seem to have difficulty with the concept of commenting and replying.

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