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ROBERT NUGENT – THE IRISH 2022 CENSUS – KEEPING THE FAITH.

Robert is right. The Roman Catholic religion will continue to shrink in Ireland.

Parish churches and chapels will close and become homes, nightclubs, bingo halls etc.

Like in France, one aging priest will look after many parishes.

RC schools will close and parents and others will be the new patrons.

Baptisms, Confirmations, church marriages and church funerals will decline and be replaced with other rites of passage.

Mass attendance will dwindle and consist of older ladies and their grandchildren.

THE CAUSE OF THE SHRINKAGE

In his video, Robert puts the blame on the bishops and priests for failing to hand on the faith to the new generations.

He also points to Catholic schools that no longer teach children their faith.

In fact, many, if not most teachers in Catholic schools no longer practice their faith themselves.

And in all of this, many are falling away – younger people, men etc.

Sometimes, people blame the secularisation and mayerialisation of the world. And I’m sure these play a significant role.

THE ROLE OF THE SCANDSLS AND ABUSE

The last 30 years of Church scandals are playing a big role.

It started to gain traction in 1992 when Bishop Eamon Casey was outed for having a passionate affair with an American woman and producing a son.

And then there was:

The tsunami of the abuse of children by priests, Brothers and nuns.

The exposure of the Magdalen Laundry Consentration Camps.

The secret mass graves of children as in Tuam.

The selling of orphans by nuns running orphanages.

The exposure of the widespread homosexual activities of priests and seminarians – tied to the gay Grindr App.

The Maynooth “Summer of Love”.

And it goes on and on………..

CHURCH AS SHAM – CLERGY AS DESPERADOES

In a few short years Irish people, and people elsewhere, realised that the Catholic Church they thought was one thing was really another thing.

Instead of it being about God and faith and prayer, it was instead just another deeply corrupt international conglomerate.

It was about money, control and a great sex life for the executives and those at the top.

Those at the “bottom” were basically told to pay up, pray up, and shut up.

While those at the top laughed all the way to the bank and the gay sauna.

A POWERFUL MEDICINE – SYRUP OF MAGISTERIUM

SYRUP OF MAGISTERIUM

And to cover all this up they have brainwashed millions and millions of ordinary Catholics over years and centuries.

They have convinced them that they are God’s true representatives on earth and anything they say, God says.

Even Robert, with all due respect, has swallowed this “medicine” – magisterium, tradition, papal infallibility, ontological change, etc, etc.

It’s all a cover for what’s really gone on and is going on.

Roman Catholicism, is as strange in some ways as Scientology or extreme Islam.

Roman Catholicism, in many of its forms, is a distortion of Christianity – the suffocating ivy over growing God’s house.

The option for us THINKING CATHOLICS is to go back and rediscover the “church” of Jesus’ time and the New Testament time.

And then try and live that.

150 replies on “ROBERT NUGENT – THE IRISH 2022 CENSUS – KEEPING THE FAITH.”

Pat I am from Northern Ireland, and I know of at least one cleric using said dating app. I was made aware of this quite recently. What was surprising was that it appears nothing has been done to address it. Should parish councils and relevant church bodies not be made aware?

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I am continually intrigued by the issues Robert concerns himself with. He wants a return to a Catholic Ireland. We know the reality of faith and Catholicism in Ireland. It’s a very changing culture for religious faith but many good things are happening in parishes. I just wish Robert and Pat would stop forever judging. Can we have constructive, creative and inspiring suggestions or remedies to our crises? We need positivity, encouragement and blessings not dour faces and looks of disillusionment, condemnation and blame. For God’s sake Robert, those of us on the ground an on our own as pastors are literally tired of your criticisms. We’re familiar with Pat but your negativity is so disheartening.

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10.04: Pat, since you’ve left the Catholic presbyterate, you are living in a parallel universe. I don’t wish to seem dismissive but you simply do not know nor are you willing to understand the changed and changing landscape in which we are trying to be a christian, caring, welcoming and inclusive parish community. Irrespective of all contributory factors outlined in your assessment, there is a cultural and historical shift away from organised religious in western countries. In our parish we have done some outreach to children and young people, with very little ling term success. What I believe we must begin doing is identify the existence of various faith/religious organised groups whose ministry is specifically abiut reaching out to “youth”. Pat, you always look for some issue with which to clobber priests. There was a time when most parishes had wonderful church youth groups and youth clubs. Much has changed. Societal norms and expectations have changed. Many educated people are making their own personal choices. Those of us on the ground in parishes know full well the realities and challenges we face. Your reply to 11.09pm is completely inadequate and lacks any relevance.

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Father I have never left the Catholic presbyterate.

I was thrown out of the Roman Catholic Clerical

The fact that you can’t see this shows you have a very big problem.

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1.03, why don’t you just focus on serving people, in a Christ-like way, instead of number-tallying by looking for results in terms of more and more bums on church pews? You have made this the measure of your success. Or failure. And in doing so, you have ensured your own disappointment and discouragement.
Despite what you may think to the contrary, your endeavours are really about YOU, not about Christ. This is what is wrong with them: your self-interested attitude is getting in the way of God’s good work.
It is not your job to convert anyone: leave the conversion of human hearts to Christ. Allow him to work through you by being as compliant as humanly possible to HIS will, not your own. You will then have done everything required of you, and will one day hear those words of Jesus: ‘Well done, good and faithful servant.’

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11:09 If you are tired of Pat and Robert’s repeated ‘negativity’ it means you keep going back to their media to hear their ‘negativity’.
You are under no obligation to do so yet you want them to stop saying things you don’t like. Trying to control the conversation as always when you just don’t have to come here.
Or do you have to come here? The only reason a cleric would hate the content of this blog yet keep coming here is fear of something being revealed about him….

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10.20: You miss the point I’m making. What purpose is served by repeating the same negativity every second day? We’ve heard Pat’s and Robert’s interpretation of realities very often. We know the crises in the Church. Those of us in parishes are trying to respond positively to difficult challenges. Surely, both of them might at least offer some methodology or template for creative solutions. Is that too daunting a task? Your comment is both flippant and superfluous..A little more intellectual commentary would be appreciated.

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10:20 Spot On & don’t forget the egotistical and proactive measures clergy & their laity pursue to dictate narrative in their exclusive favour. Censorship & Dictatorship all the way with the RCC.

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1:11 What purpose is served by returning to read the same negativity every second day?

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2.09: Chris, where in my 1.03 comment do I make any kind of reference to number tallying about bums on seats? I make no such reference or anything close to such. The only person who references to numbers in churches is Pat at 10.04am. I have never made numbers attending churches as a measure of my success. If this was my only objective I’d be gone long ago. Thankfully I’m a realist and contrary to your wrongful understanding, I hope I allow God to work through me!!!

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3.35, you did appear to be complaining about your ‘outreach to children and young people’ : that it had shown ‘very little longterm success’.

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11:09, I agree that many good things are happening in parishes. There is a need for positivity, encouragement and blessings.
+Pat and RN at the same time have made some valid points of their own.
Episcopal leadership brings Episcopal responsibilities. Episcopal leaders circling the wagons, and leaving ++DM isolated a few years ago, did not avail of an opportunity to show strong moral leadership.

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Heavens! What a bore!
Why are we listening to this man? What authority has he?
Who the hell is Robert Nugent anyway?

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Cedric: I agree. This was my first listen to Mr Nugent. In addition to the “return to Catholic Ireland ” issue as in Anon’s 11:09 comment, I found his repetition tedious, and exited when he started speaking about his family.
It seems entirely right and logical to me to have a “No religion” option heading the census choices, if indeed ANY religious affiliation choice should be offered at all. To list SOME invites criticism of prioritisation for some, and exclusion of others. I would prefer the question as: “Please state what religion, if any, you practise. Otherwise state NONE”.
That the ROI considers it necessary to calculate religious affiliation evokes memories of post civil war days of De Valera and the Irish clergy’s control of an idealised submissive uneducated state. Thankfully, times have changed.
I fully expect a big increase in those opting for ‘no religion’, especially among the younger and better educated generation.
MMM

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I also think it’s unfair not to include long-established churches like the Presbyterian and Methodist churches.

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@ 11:27am

Moaning Minnie’s back with the same ould atheistic garbage we always get. Let us pray that the poor demented oul soul gets the grace to repent before being called to The Judgement Seat when it will be too late.

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Anon@5:10 YOU pray away yourself. I don’t think your prayers are to be considered of much value. We always recognise your derogatory sobriquet so know to look out for your repetitious ad hominem hostility. Haven’t you really anything better to do?

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Cyril: that “Moanin Minnie” guy is almost as boringly reliably repetitious as the Sharon Shoesmith commentator: and always cowardly Anonymous mark you.
Commentators like this are probably wizened disgruntled perpetually negative small minded individuals with nothing to offer but their hostility.

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The one thing that history teaches is that there is no going back. For if you go back to the days of McQuaid and de Valera every one of the abuses you list will be back multiplied many times as they engineered all the cover-ups and the musical chairs of shifting the abusers, and stuffing the abused bodies of the children deeper into the sewers. The truth of the old Irish adage about going back is ‘not to start from here’. The guest says that if you don’t believe in the old Catholic values of the orphanages and the sale of children and their bodies, then click the ‘No religion’ box. He is at a loss as to why people have left. One can only pity the poor man.

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The Roman Catholic Church isn’t Christian: ‘by its fruits shall ye know them’. 😲

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Very interesting, thank you.
Can you put a date to when Christianity became Roman Catholicism? About the fourth century? Or after the split with the east?

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Maybe there was ‘consecration’ in Catholic Laundries. I do once recall a few years ago going to an interview at Donnybrook Laundry. Even though it was post 2000 there was a yellowing picture of John XXIII and ranks of older women working away. However it would be wholly wrong to call them concentration (the word surely meant) camps, and close to anti Semitic. Millions died of starvation, murder and disease in concentration camps. Many Boers died in the British originals in South Africa. Not so with the Catholic Laundries. I remember how these money sniffing public advocates were so offended at the McAleese report. These campaigners were just annoyed the government money spigot for them personally might run dry, not that money be used to help older women who did little with their lives, except enrich others. I would be cautious about Tuam. It is increasingly looking like Kamloops residential school in Canada where a lurid narrative was woven based on fabrication. And you have to dig, so to speak, to find nothing was found in Kamloops. I wonder why they are shy about digging in Tuam. I suspect they don’t want to disturb a foundation myth of the new Ireland.
The Annie Murphy stuff was almost wholesome compared to the case of the sordid Casey story, one of theft and the rape of his niece. Some evil minded people tried to portray him as a saint. I hope he committed no new crimes in Latin America.

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Nugent drones on about what he calls ‘teaching the faith in Ireland’ in relation to abortion, and other issues, as though this alone, and soundly done, would somehow fix things on the Irish moral scene by having Catholics, like obedient children, once again toe the episcopal line on everything from moral doctrine to how much they should cough up for indolent, work-shy, parasitical Irish clergy.
Is Nugent really naive enough to believe that sound catechetical instuction in Roman Catholicism is all that’s called for here?That the penny would eventually drop for such people as women in crisis pregnancies, oh, if only they could be educated out of their moral ignorance! Are you really so stupid and condescending, Nugent? What you, and your kind, cannot cope with is the fact that Irish Catholics will no longer tolerate the deep disrespect, bordering at times on contempt, with which your church traditionally treated them, and their consciences, by insisting that they obey Catholic clergy alone.
I think Nugent lost his common sense with his hair. What Nugent is really seeking here is a restoration of priestly authoritarianism in Ireland, that will allow a disgraced Catholic clergy to once again weild the moral whip over a submissive people. That was tried for far too long, Nugent, and it created an institutional climate in which your priest friends, with absolute impunity, raped and sodomised their way into ever-increasing irrelevance for Catholic clergy and their morally rotted church.
I’d like to tell you, Nugent, what you can do with your faith, and your grand plan for turning back the clock, decades, on an Irish Catholic population that is enjoying, for the very first time, freedom from a confessional and clericalist, romanist state.
The first word rhymes with ‘duck’. ‘Duck’ them both, Nugent!
Incidentally, I wonder, Pat, why you are drawn you to such righ-wing nutters as Nugent and McKeever. I think there is a significant, unconfessed part of you that yearns for the days of arch-conservative, authoritarian, Irish Romanism. It isn’t a healthy inclination.

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@10.06 The correspondent to whom you refer, Pat, made an excellent argument. I think the problem is that you seem to be using Robert Nugent’s material more and more. Nugent seems to think that if the clergy teach etc. etc. things will go back to what they should be. That is a misplaced argument. Nugent is a romantic, captured by his voice on UTube.
Please provide us with your own views, not Robert Nugent’s. Pat, we are interested in your views, not Robert Nugent’s. Let him comment but please stop putting his videos etc. on your blog.

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10:54, it is clear from the blog story that +Pat has also shared his views and was critical of RN.
You were so caught up in RN’s views that you overlooked the views of +Pat that you were seeking!!

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1:14 Spot on. The trouble with the RC junta is that you can’t be one without clergy so it always ends up with the same power trips. In Protestant Christianities there are beginning to be movements away from churches so that increasingly people are freelancing. This was aided by people being able to Zoom church hop during lockdown.
Struck by how Pat’s association with right wingers strikes you – I’d assumed it was because there is nobody vocally taking a stand who is liberal. Although I think We are Church has appeared here?

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@ 10:29am

Are you for real? ‘there is no one who is liberal taking a stand’. This blog is full of them, and as we all know ‘liberals’ can’t stand it when anybody doesn’t agree with their agenda. I for one don’t want anything to do with that dreadful mob ‘We are Church’. They are not The Church.

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Hey, folks! Look! Another right-wing control-freak and nutjob who, like Nugent, assumes the absolute right to tell people who is, and who is not, right with God.

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10.54: Just wondering of Pat communicated with Robert before putting this inane video on his blog. Neither of them though seem to have any constructive ideas abiut healing and mending a broken church except to moan, analyse and condemn. Any initiative taken by priests and parishes never seem sufficient to them.. Never.

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10.50…Jesus, what can be more vicious than your blog and your commentary…Pat…WAKEN UP.

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I suppose there is a phenomenon called “the vicious or ferocious truth”.

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1.50, a clever point.

According to the Gospel, Jesus could be quite … what’s the word? …’ caustic’ on occasion. ‘Caustic’ is semantically close to ‘vicious’.

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@ 1:14am!!!
Just because left wing nutters like you are happy, plenty are not. So why don’t you ‘Duck’ off yourself, I’m sure you have plenty of unhealthy inclinations to take up your time.

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@ 11:48am
Hey Humphery you’re just another left wing nutjob who can’t stand anyone with a contrary point of view from you. You think you’re absolutely right, but you’re not, I’m here in charity to tell you’re not.😉

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1.14: A very thought provoking comment for me as a priest to read but it’s expressed so well. I agree with your assessment of Robert. I don’t doubt the sincerity of his faith but his longing for the security of a past Catholic faith is misguided. The past created very deep sufferings and abuses. Why is Pat using Robert’s videos? In recent times, especially on the Silverstream sagas, RN became an unusual ally of Pat and I think Robert was very hurt as a result of his own badly expressed utterances. I wish that Pat would give meaningful suggestions re: true renewal in the Church.

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SUGGESTIONS:
1. Give bishops a maximum of 10 year terms and then go back to parish work.
2. Let lay people perform tasks in the Church that you don’t have to a priest to do and put those desk priests in parishes.
3. Make celibacy optional.
4. Open priesthood to women.
5. Revise RCC theology on human
sexuality.
6. Hand safeguarding over to totally independent bodies.
Just a few to start with…

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1:37pm – very good suggestions. It is wholly inappropriate to have local individuals in safeguarding – many are well known to have compromising links that completely undermines trust and transparency. A safe pair of hands for the Church but not for legitimate complainants.

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The option for us THINKING CATHOLICS is to go back and rediscover the “church” of Jesus’ time and the New Testament time. And then try and live that. I wonder if you can give us examples of gay married bishops in the early church? Even the bible says a bishop should be the husband of one wife. 1 Timothy 3:2-12 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;5
(For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
Unfortunately you are the perfect example of what the Catholic Church has become, a bishop in an open homosexual partnership pretending to be religious, the Church will never recover from that image. Oh and before you accuse me of being homophobic, forget it as I have no problem with homosexuals as I a sinner would never see myself better than them, however a celibate homosexual isn’t engaged in the act of homosexuality and therefore is not in sin. The problem with the Catholic Church is that some of it’s priests and bishops and even nuns no longer hide their sin as they love to flaunt it openly in front of their flocks.

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‘some people think there is already a vicious agenda on the blog’
I bet they also think the clergy are celibate and the holy Roman church is God’s appointed means of grace.
You couldn’t make it up!

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No thanks. I’ll stay with the Virgin Mary and the Holy Eucharist and the lawful interpreters of the scriptures. Matthew 23:3 They were as bad in Our Lord’s day and He never said leave the Temple and the Law of Moses

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‘Lawful interpreters of the scriptures’????
Has your sanity taken a leave of absence?
You sound like one of those characters in Umberto Eco’s ‘ The Name of the Rose’.😅

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Sssh, 10:48, don’t interrupt, she’s busy treating her slaves as the commandments tell her.

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No, you should say that I sound like a Texan who believes from the Bible that God gave Israel to the Ashkenazis

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I don’t know personally any of the maynooth seminarians. I contacted one a couple of months ago about a specific question. I know many ex-seminarians from Maynooth. I don’t have constant contact with current seminarians as I simply don’t know them. Let them live their own lives.

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6.04, let seminarians live their own lives? Why? They’ll soon, like you, be busy telling others how to live theirs.

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The practice of Catholicism here in Lancashire, is shrinking as it is throughout Britain. In Preston where I live, there used to be a dozen or more churches, each with presbyteries built for more than one priest. Some of them were built for as many as seven priests. Now churches are being demolished or given over to different priestly orders and in some places in the Diocese, three parishes are being served by one priest.
The days when whole families dressed to the nines to go to Sunday Mass, stopped years ago. Some people couldn`t care less about their soul, others waste time looking for a sect that will satisfy their needs. The problem is, if ever they do find a sect that would be to their liking, they won`t recognise it because their minds are wired for looking rather than finding.
God no longer exists to many lapsed Catholics, but it is amazing how many have deathbed conversions – just in case !
I can only hope that as in the Reformation under Henry V111, once the dead wood has been pruned, a stronger faith will be created consisting of fervent folks who love their faith and its history..

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9.02, do you make a point of attending the sick beds of lapsed Catholics? Any lapsed Catholic? You must do, otherwise you wouldn’t know, and be amazed by, ‘how many have deathbed conversions – just in case!’
Perhaps you just enjoy making up stuff … to liven up your posts.

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I think James is referring to the longstanding practice of first generation lapsed Catholics getting the sacraments just in case. All this demonstrates is that the fear remains in you and the cult has entered your psyche.
If anyone sent for a priest on my death bed I’d tell him to fuck off.

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A little boy of 10 was knocked down by a car on a Belfast street. An old lady put her handbag under his head and her coat to cover him. She then asks the boy if she get get him a priest. The boy answers:

“Mrs, do you not think I have enough problems just now.

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11.32, very good point.
Some Catholics just love to gloat over news of lapsed Catholics who apparently experience so-called ‘death bed conversions’; its as though they relish, even at such poignant moments, victory over the spiritually vanquished. But they dont, being so insufferably smug, look deeper for the real reason behind this behaviour: it is the fear instilled in them, from a very young and impressionable age, that if they don’t rely on the Church (that is, on priests), God will not be amused, and they’ll end up in Hell. It’s a psychological control mechanism, and a form of child abuse; but then, romanist priests are long used to this kind of behaviour; in fact, I suspect they get a phallic-stiffening buzz from it.
I should never allow a child of mine to attend a school run, or under the influence of, any of these satanic vultures and the vile cult they serve.

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Does anyone remember Conor Larkin’s fury at finding that a priest had attended at the death of his father, Old Kilty? ( Trinity, by Leon Uris)
Uris well summed up the practice of vulture like priests capitalising on “death bed weaknesses” to hoover up conversions, ……and from my own knowledge, bequests to Holy Mother Church as well!
MMM

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10.59, excellent point. And a wonderful analogy. I had forgotten this piece by American author, Uris.
Thanks for bringing it to our attention.

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@ 9:02am
Oh! please, there was no reformation under the mad monster Henry VIII, it was a rebellion from a megalomaniac who wanted a divorce and then proceeded to either execute or divorce SIX of his wives. If you think that would produce a stronger faith or fervent people who would love that history, you should think again.

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11.36: Banality at its worst…such a meaningless comment. Try your intelligence, Bishop!

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3.24, I thought it was funny. Funny, and telling😜, about how romanist priests are seen today, especially by vulnerable young boys.

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@ 12:06pm

Why don’t you go on a diet, jump on your broomstick, and hopefully please God you don’t have children. As to be raised under your satanic influence would be a disaster for any poor child.

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Every time the census comes around, we get the repeat arguments and analyses about the increasing number who proclaim to be of “no faith”. It is time for people to be absolutely honest about their religious ior non religious dentity. We are living in a rapidly changing culture at many levels. Religious faith is now a personal choice and many choose to not be affiliated to any belief system. Let’s be truthful about their choices and respect them. Catholicism is certainly in a precarious position for many if the reasons given. We know these factors contribute to people’s choices. Instead 9f repeating the rhetoric as found in Roberts video and by Pat, can we offer practical, implementable solutions? Many priests are positively engaged in creating good parish communities with many wonderful initiatives taking place. Let’s acknowledge this and despite the crises and the reasons for our predicament, can we have suggestions from the critics? The constant negativity from Pat and Robert is very disconcerting and demoralizing. All of us in parishes know only too well what we face.

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11.50, oooooh!😨 ‘Feck off to perdition’? I -I don’t know what to say, ‘cept that Mr Nugent would not be impressed. Didn’t he preach that those who don’t intercede for the likes of those you cursed will themselves not enter Heaven?

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The cathbots demonstrating their charity (and incidentally that they don’t believe their own religion) again at 11:50.

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This is not a phenomena peculiar to Ireland. Throughout Europe, all denominations are seeing a significant decline in attendance and membership. Most of the variables of relevance lie outside the churches. Robert’s analyses fails to understand them. The only growth in particular local situations has been in Anglican evangelical/charismatic churches in more wealthy locations and in those churches that offer complete certainty if you follow the rules – SSPX types , for example. Of course, without being able to live with doubt, a theology that does not embrace doubt is hardly appealing to anybody.

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Surely the examples of growth you’ve given are very much ‘no doubt’ settings and suggest people do like total certainty?

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Apology to be delivered today by 5 Ministers & representatives from 6 Religious Orders/Institutions: De La Salle, Good Shepherd Sisters, Sisters of Nazareth, Sisters of St Louis, Barnardos & The Irish Church Missions. Sir Anthony Hart, Inquiry Chair revealed shocking levels of sexual, physical & emotional abuse from 1922 to 1995 & recommendations included that those abused in State, Church and Charity run homes should be offered compensation as well as an official apology from government and the organisations which ran these residential facilities. It was also recommended that memorials for victims be erected.

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By all accounts, the victims, their relatives and supporters were not impressed with the “apologies”, referring to them as cold, hard hearted, forced and the like.
MMM

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10:37. These are very tight knit church communities – Parish Council members unlikely to do much as usually close friends and advocates of clergy for better or worse – plus on a practical level Bishops are hardly going to punish a priest for using a dating app when there is no one to replace that priest and many of them are hoping that the celibacy rule will soon be lifted. When we’ve seen how child abusers have been protected for decades in RCC, using a dating app is small fry in comparison.

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Irish Government to pay Catholic Church rent for schools that become multi-denominationalsays:

Irish Catholic Church will be paid for its schools that transfer under new 40 year leases as part of Dept. Of Education deal with Catholic Bishops. Church will retain ownership of schools & rent amount will reflect if schools have benefitted from State capital investment in the past. 89 percent of primary schools are Catholic.

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Everything in this video is music to my ears. That cult just can’t shuffle off the island and die fast enough.

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A major red flag about Nugent is his self-righteous, presumptious arrogance. Such people just can’t resist personal power-tripping by telling others who will, and who will not, go to Heaven. They present themselves, not Christ, as the ticket to salvation.With Nugent in the video, hypocrites are his bugbear, but you can be sure that he has a long list of people HE considers equally unworthy. What monumental arrogance! Incidentally Pat, Nugent includes you and Eddie on this list; that’s why he says he prays for you both. Perhaps you missed that bit of smug judgementalism.

I am sick to the back teeth of Roman Catholic pharasaism; Nugent is its latest representative on the blog. These people don’t attract others; by and large, they repel them.

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The churches of Ireland and the UK would be full of young people and more men, if they became Divine Renovation parishes. Deacon Ronan Sheehan is learning about this during his internship in Canada. He will inspire priests, bishops and lay people, when he is ordained priest later this year and working in a Cork parish.

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11.47, all hail Ronan! Ronan the Great!

I swear to God you ‘ducking’ people are something else. 😕

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I don’t represent the Church. I’m not being secretly funded by anyone. I’m calling people back to the one truth. Anyone who is baptised can do this. You are free to listen or free to ignore me.

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6.00, Robert, the presumptiousness in your post is almost innocent for its lack of self-awareness.
So you, YOU, are calling people back to the ‘one truth’ ? Well, Robert, if you are calling them back, it means that, contrary to your motif, the Faith HAS been properly taught in Ireland; it is just that very many Irish Catholics no longer recognise YOUR truth as either true, or singularly true.
As for our being free either to listen to or ignore you, may I ask you a question? Where did you acquire such arrogance about yourself? Why would you ever think yourself worthy of anyone’s attention? You aren’t the first in history with a Messiah complex.
You, and your insufferably self-righteous kind, are, in no small part, responsible for so many in Ireland who have turned away from an institution ‘corrupt, and riddled with corruption’. And for this I thank you from the bottom of my heart.

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Not clear statistics however in the 2016 census 41.3% of those describing themselves as RCs (who were 78.3% of the population or 3.73 million) reported weekly mass attendance.
Source: https://faithsurvey.co.uk/irish-census.html
It’s when it comes to baptisms the statistics become confused, because all baptisms of children are recorded for the year the baptism occurs. So some years there are more baptisms than there were births!
What I think is clear is nearly all babies born are baptised across the board (source: https://www.thejournal.ie/sham-baptism-divestment-reasons-ceremony-2873282-Aug2016/).
So the answer to your question is that the more than half of the Catholic population who don’t go to mass every week still have their babies baptised. I would draw this conclusion from the almost universal baptism rather than reliable statistics about your question and of course these figures are from six years ago.
The church is also reporting a decline in interest since the pandemic which would further confuse the picture:https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/a-possible-disaster-catholic-church-reckons-with-declining-interest-post-pandemic-1.4557615
The CSO has fascinating stuff: https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-cp8iter/p8iter/p8rrc/

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What an incredibly patronising and arrogant man Robert is. People know fine well what the Catholic church teaches, we’ve had it drummed into us for years, we just don’t believe in it. People are pitiful ignoramouses who just don’t get it, as Robert and Fulton Sheen are and were convinced, people can think for themselves and do so very well. At no point in history were the people of Ireland, North and South better educated, more able to critically assess teachings and come to their own conclusions. They’ve decided they don’t believe in the Roman Mafia anymore and have moved on. Belief in God isn’t dead, belief in the man made institution is.

People don’t go to Mass anymore because they don’t want to promote an organization that abuses children, degrades women, condemns homosexuals and is riddled with corruption. If the RCC was a secular business, it would go bankrupt, it has nothing to offer and doesn’t sell itself. With so many alternative options, different places to seek transcendence and a relationship with the divine, all very valid may I add, Romanism doesn’t offer anything worth buying into. Christianity as it stands just now doesn’t on the whole.

Look at the seminaries, giant closets for those unprepared to embrace who they really are, predatory hunting grounds for those who couldn’t pull in the real world and factories for producing emotionally injured people. Of the 2011 intake of seminarians, 20 entered, the vast majority left and most are happily living lives true to themselves as gay men now, that was the last big intake of seminarians and entrance has nose dived ever since.

Robert really needs to enter the real world quickly, particularly if he wants to give his church any future. Holding the belief that the people of Ireland are just too thick to get Catholicism is far from the reality and trying to fight that not only puts people off further, but it’s a totally futile endeavour. Catholic Ireland is gone and is never coming back, because the people don’t want it to come back, they understand it far too well and don’t want any part of it. They’ve matured spiritually and left behind the tyrannical old ways of man made doctrines turned into infallible dogmas.

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Actually if the church was a secular business it would be kept afloat by Russian oligarchs. And probably is anyway.

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You might know what the Church teaches, but I certainly didn’t know when I was educated in the 80s and still the same today in schools. You might actually be surprised how bad the faith is taught in Ireland.

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LOL you’ve wound up the cathbots today, Pat. They’d love you to shut up.
I think you should shut up when they shut up about abortion. Nobody’s forcing them to have one, but they’re happy to interfere in other people’s lives….
Just like they say you’re doing!
You couldn’t make it up!

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2.39: This type of comment has been made almost verbatim very frequently on this blig. I’m presuming you are the author. Since it appears to suggest a deficit of education and limited vocabulary, may I respectfully suggest a return to primary school. “You couldn’t make it up” is your giveaway sentence!! Indeed “you” couldn’t make it up…

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I’m howling with laughter at all the comments saying they don’t want to hear what Robert or Pat have to say.
Yet they’re on here whinging about it. 😂

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4.25
Of course. You missed the reference to Philippians. Were you asleep in Killarney’s classes?
“Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.” (Philippians 2:12).

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5.36
Out of humility I won’t tell you what John Quinlan told me concerning myself, he had observed I never really took notes! Many the long afternoons I spent with him and the treasured fossil he had in Front Stoyte. I have only ever slept in bed.

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There are very few things in life that a priest who has quit his ministry is absolutely sure of, it is my understanding that changes after five years: but; of this I am sure as I have been since 1989 when I spoke to others of him in the environs of the Divis Flats; Pat Buckley is a good man. A very good man is Buckley. Set upon by a very powerful multinational and he is still standing and helping people ( not withstanding the sundering of clergy….when unwarranted .) A really good man… Pat Buckley… take note Bergoglio and Co.

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6.21 In private and not spoken of… of course… for Maynooth was full of the same demographic as this Blog.

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7.37
I have my doubts you meant, as your comment claims, that the only thing you ever did in bed is sleep. I’m sure you read in bed at least once in your life.

Were you asleep in First Arts logic?

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the HOLY PROPHET nugent says wise words and should be heeded so his words so not clash with the words of HOLY PRIESTS

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8.15
If you take to a book on a divan this night, may I recommend something from Descartes. You are sure and you have your doubts; these are indeed progressive states. Logic can be overrated when you are imagining what someone else might do in bed.

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Thanks Pat for posting. Just reading the comments now. I’m amazed the people who get a annoyed because I did a video and annoyed you discussed it.

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2.43, I’m betting you’re not howling with laughter at all. I’m betting you made that up… for effect, like. 😀

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No actually I was! They keep coming back despite saying they don’t want to read the blog. they’re hilarious!

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The blog’s headline today, and some comments, refer to “The Faith” in the sense of a set of beliefs as determinants for behavior. In one sense, it refers to the Roman Catholic Church.
Elsewhere, when discussing reasons for believing, some say we must “have faith.”
So what is it?
One analogy to consider:-
The path away from unquestioning faith is a bit like getting out of a bath. From being fully immersed in the bath’s warm “baptismal” waters, eventually, questioning doubts , like an increasing chill, makes emerging a sensible option. Staying in a hot bath by topping up water has limited appeal and leads to loss of energy, weakness and apathy. Losing ‘the faith’ is a bit like getting out of the hot bath. You may initially feel “heavy”, but quickly adjust. You don’t miss the ‘water support ‘ at all and get on with living without worrying if you will be sunk with a huge debt of paying for all that ‘hot water.’
And anyway the hot water goes down the plughole taking the froth with it.
MMM

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MMM, a lot of people who might have doubts about their religion do not identify as atheist. The census statistics will not be reflective of that.
There are a few Independents in Dáil Éireann who are of the Fianna Fáil gene pool. The RCC has theists of their gene pool.
The GAA are the only pillar of old rural Ireland still going strong, for now.

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7.47
Every right-thinking Christian will question her/his faith and beliefs. Our faith is over 2,000 years old – our thinking isn’t.

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5.36, Jesus trumps Paul, I’m afraid. Didn’t he tell his followers NOT to be afraid? I’m sure he did.

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6.05
Sounds like MC’s biblical studies exhumed. There’s no contradiction. What Jesus wishes us to avoid is fear as in dread. What Paul recommends is awe and reverence. The Hebrew and Greek roots are polyvalent and some nuance is required.

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8.11, I love that word, ‘nuanced’; most who express it really don’t know what it means, but they toss it into the mix anyhow.
If what you say about the etymology of ‘fear’ is correct, then why didn’t the biblical translators make those, erm, nuances clear? I guess they just weren’t fortunate enough to have you as a tutor. Or maybe they decided that the relevant ancient passages were, after all, best translated as ‘fear’ as we understand the word today. Well, they must have done, since the translation of Paul reaffirms this sense through usage of the word ‘trembling’.
No, there is indeed no contradiction … between the fact that Jesus and Paul both use words which have the the same meaning. But from here I beg to differ: there is indeed contradiction between the admonitions of Jesus and Paul, since each offers advice contrary to the other. The question is, then: whose advice does one follow? Which directly returns us to my comment at 6.05, and it, in turn, correctly suggests the answer.
Incidentally, the word ‘dread’ itself means ‘great fear’.

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8.48
There is a maxim which is apt and which relates to translating in general, and not just in biblical contexts: tradere traducere.
One reply to one of your concerns is to state that a principle of biblical interpretation involves asking: how does this sense of a passage fit in with the overall biblical message. Many cases of theophany in the Hebrew Bible are accompanied by the injunction ‘Do not be afraid.’ So to translate Paul as recommending the opposite ought to cause an interpreter to consult the sources including Hebrew and Greek lexicons. Which I did.
Do n

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9.28, theophanic admonitions in the Old Testament, in addition to the oblique theophany of Mary’s Annunciation, weren’t expressed puposelessly: they came in wake of the natural , human psychological reaction to the unknown; it is in such moments that humanity recognises its abject and unalterable vulnerability. In a nutshell, those reactions were of fear. Real fear.

That Paul advocates something Jesus admonished against shouldn’t surprise anyone, because Paul was human, not divine; and therefore entirely fallible. And it shows in some of his writings. Should this have concerned biblical translators, that Paul is at odds with Christ in this respect? Why? Presumably they, like me, made allowances for his fallible humanity and hoped that others would be sensible enough to follow suit.

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I wiukd live to know how Robert feels after the “v”ommentary against him today by church hating trolls. These trolls delight in nastiness and vicious diatribes. Pat didn’t come to Robert’s rescue after using his video…A very puzzling liaison between the two of them. Very strange dynamics. Where art thou O Robert? “In my pocket” says Pat!!

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6.12: Pat, no one could surpass you in cynicism. Anyway, most comments today re: RN’s video are mocking and judgmental of him and are deeply cynical and hurtful. As before Robert chooses a peculiar subject to go crazy on…the 2022 census. What can we expect from a “post catholic” country? Very sad. I truly believe that Robert, as a very good committed Catholic should focus on evangelizing through his prayer, faith, Christian convictions and supporting others like him in their faith journey. He has so much to offer in this regard. I think the census issue was bound to elicit nasty comments against him.

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I’m not offended by the comments, or the blog Post. I’m just amazed at the commentary. As I said, unlikely friends with opposite options can discuss things.

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This video is a ZOOM talk given by Tom Doyle to We Are Church Ireland on 28. February 2022.
Tom Doyle is a priest, canon lawyer, addictions therapist and long-time supporter of justice and compassion for clergy sex abuse victims.He sacrificed a rising career at the Vatican Embassy to become an outspoken advocate for church abuse victims. Since 1984, when he became involved with the issue of sexual abuse of children by Catholic clergy while serving at the Embassy, he has become an expert in the canonical and pastoral dimensions of this problem – working directly with victims, their families, accused priests, bishops, and other high-ranking Church officials.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=il4iPxsEOCI
“Abuse and Cover-up in the Catholic Church” – Thomas P. Doyle

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‘Johnny’ if it was your concern you wouldn’t need to be asking for news on this blog, would you? You would know what was happening with them!

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Great cover to VOL.40. No.5 of The Phoenix and Page 6 of interest to Rathgar coverage by this Blog.

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Hi William have you opened up a process of reconciliation with Ryan in Belgium. Please be honest and transparent

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