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BISHOP ELECT – HOMOSEXUALS – NO PLACE IN SEMINARIES OR PRIESTHOOD.

From Complicit Clergy

“The bishop-elect of Columbus, Ohio, has challenged the admission of men with homosexual tendencies into seminaries, vigorously defending Pope Benedict XVI’s ban on ordaining gays as priests.

Father Earl Fernandes, the first priest of Indian origin to be appointed a bishop in the United States, warned against the priesthood being seen “as a refuge for those who would not desire marriage,” given “the continual devolution of sexuality in the culture.”
Benedict’s Instruction

In an academic book titled Seminary Formation and Homosexuality, Fernandes argues that, according to Benedict, even “support of the homosexual movement” is sufficient “to disqualify a candidate from the priesthood.”

“Such a person cannot be judged to have the requisite affective maturity demanded of the priestly vocation and cannot properly assume the role of father and spouse,” writes the priest. The 44-page book is an elaboration of his earlier journal article on the topic.

Fernandes demonstrates how Benedict’s comments prohibiting homosexuals in seminaries in his book Light of the World “do not represent a new teaching of the Church.”

The former pontiff’s comments are “perfectly consistent with the Church’s doctrine and norms regarding homosexuality and the sacrament of Holy Orders,” the 49-year-old Cincinnati cleric notes, lamenting the fact there has been “little reference” to the instruction since its publication in 2005.

“It is no small matter to stand in persona Christi at the altars of the Church,” Fernandes emphasizes. Priests “are to be men, configured to Jesus Christ (the head, shepherd and spouse of the Church), capable of giving themselves completely to their Bride the Church with generous hearts, animated by the true spirit of pastoral charity.”

God Fearing Souls

December 24, 2018 from by

A former seminarian shares his personal experience as a student at the Pontifical seminary in Columbus, Ohio in the mid-1990s.  The age-old battle of good versus evil has infiltrated a system once designed to produce good men for the Catholic priesthood. What is happening today is a perversion of the original intent of the seminary—rife with sexual congress, homosexuals, and scandal—things are not what they once were.  The pontifical seminary directly injects men into positions of weight within the Catholic Church, but a number of these men, destined to be priests, are poised to cause damage from the inside out.  Atheists, agnostics, and immoral men have placed themselves in positions of authority and influence within Catholicism’s most sacred institutions. These evils exist for a dastardly purpose, and it is astonishing.  The belief that these institutions are places of purity and godly thought is a dangerous one, but God-Fearing Souls offers a rare, raw glimpse at scandals and debauchery heretofore untold in an attempt to shine light in dark places. It exposes the ugly truth and illuminates what has been covered up for so long.

PAT SAYS

The RCC is absolutely clear on its teachings about homosexuality and homosexuals in the priesthood and seminaries.

Their teaching says that homosexual acts are DISORDERED AND MORTALLY SINFUL.

They also say that HOMOSEXUALS ARE NOT WELCOME IN THE PRIESTHOOD OR IN SEMINARIES.

*** Of course I personally disagree with Rome on these matters***

Buy that is their teaching.

The fact that there are thousands of priests and bishops and seminarians who are homosexually active does not invalidate this teachings for the RCC.

It just means that all those priests and bishops are HYPOCRITES.

And bishops and seminarians are breaching their own church teachings and allowing homosexually active men into the priesthood and seminaries.

WHY HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE RCC IF YOU ARE A HOMOSEXUAL?

If you are a homosexual why would you want anything to do with a Church that regards you as disordered and sinful?

Why not just pray to God who does NOT think you are disordered and sinful?

And if you want to be a priest why not join a Church who will accept you as you are and even love you for it?

I was a RC priest for 10 years and I’m now an “independent” Catholic priest and bishop for 12 years and 24 years.

I have a much happier and fuller life as an independent priest than I would have had as an RC one.

I don’t have to worry about canon laws or hierarchies.

I simply ask myself every day: :What would Jesus do” and then go and do it.

No need to beg a bishops permission or have to out up with his mood swings.

No need to be filling out endless forms and consulting chancellors (chancers) or other self important HMS Pinofore types.

Just look at the New Testament and do what Jesus tells you to do.

In the future most priests will be part time and holding down another job that pays his way.

Churches will be replaced by house churches or basic Christian communities – with people like the local plumber celebrating Mass.

173 replies on “BISHOP ELECT – HOMOSEXUALS – NO PLACE IN SEMINARIES OR PRIESTHOOD.”

8:48 True! It’s their highly visible addiction to seeking attention & having the last word at all costs, even if it means making a fool of themselves in the process. Lip service only paid to humility – in practice notions of humility are utilised as a tool to keep the sheep in order. Freemasons.

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You say Earl Fernandes has written an “academic book” on homosexuality and priestly formation. I followed the link you provided. It’s a 44-page speech published by an institute of priestly formation. Much of it is simply sections of Benedict’s “Light of the World” document with a few rather obvious annotations. Earl is clearly a company man with few ideas of his own.

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Good post.
Yes, I thought his fans had over-egged the pudding that his ‘book’ (all 44 pages of it😂) was worthy of being described as ‘academic’. I suppose they, too, found his talk embarassingly short of intellectual rigour and decided upon a distraction: that ‘book’.😕

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‘The age-old battle of good versus evil has infiltrated a system once designed to produce good men for the Catholic priesthood.’

Except that priesthood is the evil. 🤣

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Our local plumber is a thoroughly genuine decent chap – what you see is what you get with him – out with the current hypocritical clergy & their toxic laity & in with transparency at all levels in the RCC

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I don’t give a toss whether anyone is straight, gay or whatever. It’s the bloody hypocrisy that sickens me. Don’t stand behind a pulpit telling me how to live my life when you are doing whatever the hell you like. The RCC is wired to the moon

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I’m glad you don’t give a toss because masturbation is a mortal sin and if you die without repenting you’ll burn in hell.

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Happy shoot yourself in the foot day to all bishops, priests, deacons and anyone preparing himself for impregnation, sorry, ordination.

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What an illiterate crock! 🤣

‘… given the continual DEVOLUTION of sexuality in the culture’? What does this mean? It’s a nonsense phrase, and it emphasises the inherent risks in allowing someone whose (presumably) first language isn’t English to pronounce on such serious subjects.

IF English is Fernandes’ first language, then his ability to think logically and to express himself with clarity is in serious doubt: I suppose, then, he would make an excellent romanist bishop. 😂

Fernandes ticked more or less every clericalist box about how priests perceive themselves: as spiritual fathers (with, of course, nothing to learn); as mature leaders; as other Christs; as holy heroes. These silly, self-aggrandising clichés will go down with some like jock straps at Pride, but only with an ever-shrinking, greying minority.

Fernandes just doesn’t get it, and he probably never will. The once-popular notion of the priest as ‘local hero’ has now been exploded into a trillion pieces, and, like Humpty Dumpty, it can never be put back together.

It is humility that is needed now from priests, not grandstanding on outdated clericalist notions of priesthood, the very pious-sounding pretensions that have driven the RC institutional church to the brink of global derision and irrelevance.

Cometh the hour, cometh the man. But it really shouldn’t be a cultural anachronism like Earl Fernandes. 😕

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He did serve three years 2016 – 2019 as a secretary in the Nunciature in Washington. That would have been good training for him and given him access to much needed advice, not to mention familiarity with troublesome issues being dealt with, and of course, a network of contacts.

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‘Devolution is the statutory delegation of powers from the central government of a sovereign state to govern at a subnational level, such as a regional or local level. It is a form of administrative decentralization.’
Could it possibly be he wants people to go back to doing what the church tells them?

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12.18

I posted at 9.48.

Fernandes’ expression is so nonsensically, illogically phrased that it doesn’t mean anything, really, except to Fernandes himself. It will, in a Humpty Dumpty-esque way, mean whatever he wants it to mean, even if it means nothing on its own. I suppose this is what comes from being practiced in such dark arts as ‘mental reservation’: one just becomes darker himself in whatever else he says and does.

Devolution, technically speaking, is a form of power sharing. So, yes, your comment on the word is correct. But how does one share sexuality? How does one delegate it? You get my point?

I should expect a romanist bishop-elect to be a good communicator, at the very least. Not a morally calibrated character (Heavens no!); just a good intellect. Fernandes hasn’t even this little.

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11:54 Quite. Although you wouldn’t expect him to be good at sharing would you?
Actually since commenting that it’s made me think about sharing sex and sexuality and it’s interesting the definition I stole, which was the first in a Google search, mentions sovereignty.
As a sovereign state you also wouldn’t expect a neighbouring state to dictate your domestic policy unless you had come to such arrangement.
Once again, despite proclaiming the sanctity of the person, of marriage and sexuality, Rome indicates that it’s key foreign policy is that it is always sovereign.
They want to be careful about that, once you don’t recognize another person’s sovereignty over their body, you’re on the way to sexual assault and rape.
Remarkable how those subjects keep coming up.

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1.25
Your final two paragraphs in particular are very good and have me thinking. Are you suggesting that Fernandes expects that Rome dictate human sexuality rather than a person’s awakening to this himself or herself?

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2:20 Oh yes indeedy. As well as all the other obvious stuff about identity, expression and sexual health.
Usually when people invade your sex life without permission it’s a crime and honestly that’s the best reason reproductive health and abortion in particular should be in the hands of the woman, because if a clergyman tries to get in there it’s akin to raping her.

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Pat, as we celebrate this most sacred time, we, as priests, should be even more determined to ask “WHAT WOULD JESUS DO…?” It’s a question many of us ask today because we are called, as pastors, to imitate JESUS alone. Holy Thyrsday is a day to recommit anew to true service in imitation of Christ. While we cannot dismiss all moral teachings of our Church, more frequently I ask precisely that question – What would Jesus say or do?…This is a profound question for all in gospel, Christ like service. However, while we might believe we are “following” Christ, and genuinely trying to do so, our words, opinions, language and behaviour is anything but Christ like. We can often deceive ourselves when we don’t bring all our activity under the light of Christ’s expectations of us. I wish you a blessed Holy Thursday.

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9.56

You sound rather smug. Self-righteous. Sort of looking at the speck in your eye, Pat, but ignoring the log in my own.

Just saying.

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10.19: Nothing smug at all, cynic. I am only too well aware of my priestly failings. But I am always open to being challenged and what better time than Holy Thursday to allow my life self scrutiny through the lens of Holy Thursday liturgy. Your comment is weird.

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Get over your dishonesty, 11.32. You were moralising at Pat; and none too subtly either. All that ‘our words, opinions, language and behaviour is (sic) anything but Christ-like’?
Spare me the affected blamelessness.

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9:56am. Jesus would not do any of the bad things that some members of the RCC mafia do.

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11.26: A rather superfluous comnent. Of course Jesus would not do some of the “things” carried out by RCC…That’s my point at 9.56: Jesus alone must be the source and reference, the exemplar, of pastoral service.

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11.50: I know what I meant: my comment obviously ‘got’ you. I can only conclude that you truly understand the toxicity of badly chosen words, language, opinions and nasty behaviour. Thankfully you get my message. Aren’t you very clever? Now, go and put the message into practice.. Pat is bigger than your cynical and puny mind.

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Pat
You keep referring to the fact that ‘active homosexuals’ are not welcome in the priesthood. The whole point is that ALL homosexual are not welcome or suitable. It’s important to be clear and to leave no room for ambiguity.

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Yes the actual teaching is a long term or permanent homosexual orientation is not acceptable. There’s nothing about practicing.
In other words prison gay is ay ok.

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10:32
Yes, that is exactly what the Church is saying with regard to ALL homosexual men. It is the same terminology used for marriage annulments. The basic argument made is that homosexual men cannot commit etc because their is a general problem with maturity which cannot be overcome by definition of their sexual identity. As I said, I don’t agree with the teaching but that IS the teaching. I think it is insincere of you to suggest celibate homosexual men are suitable when that is not the case in the Catholic Church. The teaching extends to all, no exceptions.

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Pat at 10:32 it is exactly like saying all black men are unacceptable.
Your years outside the cult have made you see things as a compassionate human being 👍

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9.45

L’ église, c’est moi! might have been ex-Pope Benedict’s personal motto when he wrote those silly prohibitions on homosexual candidates for the priesthood. But, like the equally delusional monarch, King Louis XIV (‘L’ état, c’est moi! ‘), Benedict’s self-identification with something much greater, the Church, is an indication that he, too, lost his head. In a manner of speaking.

Benedict is not the Church. Therefore, his teaching is neither the teaching of the Church, nor has it any authority, morally speaking, beyond the weight of personal opinion.

You can’t make a dwarf a giant.

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10:13 He’d never make it to Ordination- difficult to remain celibate when you have to live-in for years with rampant and promiscuous homosexual clergy that are disrespectful of the rights of others & supported in that by their management. The Killaloe Seminarians are one example of how that works in seminaries.

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I am not saying I agree with that teaching but you keep saying ‘active homosexuals’ are not suitable. In truth the Church does not make that type of distinction. The point being made, with regard to Church teaching, is that all homosexual men are and always will be unsuitable. It does not matter if they are active or not.

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So, 9.45, human maturity comes from… sexual orientation? This is what I’m getting from your post, especially the bit about marriage annulment.

I have known of heteronormatively married gay men who then went on to separate from their wives, years later, and found male partners. But it wasn’t lack of maturity that made them quit marriage; on the contrary, it was precisely this self-same personal quality.

Nonsense is not teaching. The RCC is nonsensical in its analysis of, and conclusions on, homosexuality. There isn’t even an atom of reputable psychological evidence to substantiate it claims.

No one is obliged to accept such nonsense. More to the point, there is a moral obligation to show it for what it is, because it leads to ‘unjust discrimination’.

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How can a celibate homosexual man be unsuitable for priesthood when the chief priest, Jesus himself, was ‘tempted in EVERY way’, but did not sin?
If he was tempted in every such way, then he must have had even paedophilic thoughts, which, of course, he resisted.
To redeem humankind, Jesus must have experienced the gamut of moral temptation. If he did not, then he does not know the struggles of these people to remain chaste: to be holy.

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10.30
You are projecting your homophobia on to the church. Exactly where in the church’s magisterium is the source of your outlandish claim and bizarre assumption?

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9.58
Your attempt to be clear, dogmatic and absolutist is shoddy.
The phrases ‘not welcome’ and ‘not suitable’ are not legal language and, in the circumstances, inane.

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11:37
‘Are not legal language’
Did I explicitly state or suggest that they were? You are extrapolating a false conclusion based on your own false premise.

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11.38
Since it’s not legal language, it’s not something to be acted on. It has the status of opinion, yours in this case. And that is all.

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I agree. Black men can be honosexul, straight, bi-sexual, promiscuous or whateve, the same as white men or men of different colour. Colour does not define the person. Sex or sexuality does.
Pax
Garngad Lad

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That’s not an enlightened comment at all.

No one.is defined by ONE aspect of their makeup.

I happen to be gay. But also I am a priest a partner, a brother, an uncle, a citizen, a customer etc.

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By Post Author

Hello and welcome to Catholic anthropology 101.
As long as you’re Catholic and prepared to claim not to be gay you’re good.
Nothing else decides you. Not even being Scottish.
Join us again tomorrow for Catholic hamburger flipping.

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11.09
It should be entertaining because Garngad’s answer will, inevitably, constitute perhaps the strongest blast of verbal flatulence I have ever read.

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He may be a lovely man, but he’s self-aggrandisingly deluded.
He’s far from lovely to those who irritate him, for whatever reason. Ask the news reporter whose hand he petulantly, patronisingly slapped.
Raise your head, Majella. You’ll see more.

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Pope Benadict was clear all homos are not suitable for the priesthood, even if they express support for gay rights,so serving priests who fall into this category should go,?
I know a priest In cloyne who spoke from the pulpit in favour of the gay marriage refforindrum, a close friend of Big Mick Lomasaney by the way.
Should he not go?

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10.39
A disgusting and ignorant comment, attempting to create guilt by association.
The teferendum asked peope for their decision on civil marriage for gay people. One does not have to be gay or religious to hold that the security thus offered to gay people is good for society. Pope Francis agrees.

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@Anon 6:34. Well you’ve “got me” there, …..I think not!
Have you no idea of how ridiculous that is:”conclusive non proof for the existence of God ?” You can’t even get the contradictory proposition correct!
And as for the China teapots circling Mars, oh yes they may well be up there alright: for I can’t prove their “non existence” either.
Keep at it: the ‘penny might drop.’
MMM

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7.15

So you CAN’T prove the non-existence of God, can you, MMM? Hence the absurdity of your dismissal of theistic faith and belief.

Don’t get too excited about my oversight: it was a lapse of attention, not a deficiency of knowledge.

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9.33

MMM, my phrase ‘prove the non-existence of God’ isn’t a logical fallacy, if this is what you are hinting. It concerns validation of propositional non-existence, not objective non-being.

You don’t know what this means, do you? It’s a form of theoretical reasoning in which propositions are made for, in this case, the existence or non-existence of a premise, God. What it isn’t is empirical validation of either proposition.

I have the grace not to ask how foolish you feel.

My point stands: you cannot dismiss that which you merely presume not to exist. Therefore, your dismissal of theistic faith and belief is intellectually absurd. Perhaps you already know this, and it’s why you keep introducing strawmen: to distract attention from your embarrassment.

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@7:37: Oh dear! You still don’t “get it” do you? Keep at it………Okay, I’ll try to help you, for I’m always willing to assist the “needy”.
Put “prove non existence” into your search engine: read and consider. Then, if you so wish, report back here on just how foolish you feel.
MMM

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Pat, I challenge you on your contention that the RCC is ‘absolutely clear on its teaching on homosexuality and homosexuals in the seminaries.’

Further that ‘…this teaching says homosexual acts are disordered and mortally sinful.’

Where exactly in the teaching of the church are such statements to be found? And what is the level of their authority, in the hierarchy of truths? For example, are they on a par with requirements to fast on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday? Are they on the same level as Jesus Christ’s command to make disciples of all nations?

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Pat said:
“I have a much happier and fuller life as an independent priest than I would have had as an RC one.”

Superficially maybe, but do reflect on where you will spend eternity.

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You were not saved by the cross. You were saved because cause willed it when Jesus rose from the dead.

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Okay +Pat if that’s what you want to believe.
However “want” is an inappropriate word here. Your “want” is an imbued, absolutely convinced belief: a belief “injected” into your childhood consciousness and reinforced by familial, educational, environmental circumstances, and subsequently sustained by your chosen career choices. So you really have little choice but to maintain such a deluded belief system. [You said in the past that you wanted to be a priest from childhood]
So there’s little point in anyone trying to point out how ridiculous is the belief of being “saved” by “the Cross”, in fact the whole absurd and abhorrent concept of vicarious redemption.

Just think: Most right thinking objectively informed people regard Putin’s actions as appalling. Most would wish him to be held accountable.
But hey ho, he appoints one of his minions to “take the rap” for his misdemeanours and receive the punishment. Would that be okay?
MMM

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12.04
You are confusing the Ablative of the Instrument (Pat’s initial statement) and the Ablative of the Agent (your attempt at correction by wrongly negating his phrasing).
Consider the sixth verse of Venantius Fortunatus’ (530-609) Vexilla regis, Vespers hymn for Holy Week:
‘O crux, ave, spes unica,
hoc Passionis tempore!
piis adauge gratiam,
reisque dele crimina.’
The poet, metaphorically, asks the cross to remove the sins from the guilty.
So, less dogmatism, if you please.

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3:39 Absolutely delighted to see someone who has made a careful study of the trinity and christology. Unfortunately your orthodox understanding does not deflect from the simple fact that humankind’s nature which required redemption was created by god and then sinned because he gave them free will.
This orthodox view of redemption conveniently ignores the fact that the single god you talk about is omnipotent and so could have stopped this happening but didn’t.
If god is the originator of the whole train of events and doesn’t stop it, sorry but the problem is god not human nature. He is also a monster of cruelty.
In reality if you set someone up like this they would be quite right to take legal action for the cruel and coercive nature of the relationship.
The Christian god is an abusive father, not a loving one.

Don’t worry, by the way, once I started questioning at my Catholic school I discovered Calvinism and guessing that I am predestined to damnation have had an incredible amount of fun ever since and if your bullshit is real am virtually guaranteed not to be with you for eternity.

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1.00
MMM, no one BUT Jesus could ‘ “take the rap” ‘. No one but God could love perfectly (remain faithful to love’s precepts) while enduring all the world could chuck at him. Yet (and here’s the paradox), this love HAD to be expressed by a human being, since it was humankind’s nature, not God’s, that required moral regeneration. So what to do?
Are you really so obtuse that you still cannot recognise the sacrifice God willingly made for our salvation?
There is only one God. God took the rap on Calvary, in the person of Jesus Christ. Father, Son, and Holy Spirit were nailed to the wood that day. ‘God’, in another word.

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+Pat, and Anon@3:39.
ON FAITH:
Faith , in matters of belief in the afterlife, and the relevance of its contingent religious beliefs, is nothing but a cloak, indeed an absurd one, for aspirational wishful thinking focused on indoctrinated beliefs to give comfort and reassurance. Thus it acts as a counterbalance to the reality of our relatively insignificant existence, and the certainty of our demise.
Faith in religious belief is perpetuated by transmission into young impressionable minds, and is incorporated into consciousness and reinforced by the conventions of communal living. It is an insidious oil greasing the palms of the clerical apparatus.
Faith is referred to by believers as a great gift of God.
A priest in Vergil’ s Aeneid has a very apt expression for this:
“Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes”.
MMM

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3.10
I am the poster at 3.39.
Yes, God could indeed have stopped humankind from sinning and, therefore, from becoming addicted to sin. The trouble is, if he had, he would have had to go on and on stopping it, depriving it of moral choice, and would have created a sub-set of that kind: beautiful, almost statuesque, morally enslaved…automatons. This is not God’s nature, and, as we all are created from his very self (not from nothing, as my childhood catechism stated), then it cannot be our nature either.
An abusive father is, by definition, a controlling one. God is the very antithesis of this. You’ll thank him for it, eventually.

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5.01
MMM, if you are correct (that faith in God, along with its associated beliefs, is nothing but an absurd cloak), then you can, of course, prove this by providing not just definitive but conclusive non-proofs for the existence of God, and the rest. If you possess these, I’ll willingly join you in declaring my faith and beliefs an absurd cloak. I don’t doubt that you have these non-proofs, because I know you to be too canny a man, too clever, not to fire his cannon without first checking that he had loaded the shot.
Lots of things are ‘transmitted to impressionable young minds’; I suspect even your atheism. You impart what you believe to have value. So, too, do Christians.

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Forget the theology below the original comment, is nobody going to comment on the breathtaking arrogance with which Scots Bitch threatens Pat with damnation for not being an apparatchik of the church of Rome?

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Anon @ 3:10: Nice one! I love it when religious beliefs are shown up as the absurdity they are. Well done.
MMM

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Thank you MMM! You will also be delighted to know that shortly after discovering Calvinism the school was forced to make me head boy because the only other boy in the sixth form was never there.

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Pat, why does Archbishop Eamon Martin reward young priests in Armagh who live homosexual lifestyles everyday?

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A lot of talk circulating Tyrone about one individual whom you addressed recently Pat. I’m sure you know there’s even more.

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Outrage among some parents in Co. Tyrone as education links developed certain European university.

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2.46: Pat, MMM is attacking your faith position again. He composes lengthy pieces and your reply to him is very snappy. I wonder why MMM always feels the need to question your stated beliefs and demolish them?

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I did not intend to be snappy. I have no proofs or evidence to offer MMM.

I can only offer my faith – my faith of over 60 years, and the hope and peace it gives me.

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3.17
You do have evidence to offer MMM, Pat. But no amount of evidence will ever satisfy him, because he’s a scoffer: a rationalist whose fundamentally entrenched outlook is that God does not exist; therefore, every supposed evidence for God’s existence can be rationalised away.

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Anon@ 10:43: Even your own words show the futility of belief in God. I quote you: “every SUPPOSED evidence for God’s existence…..”
“supposed” indeed: very revealing!
MMM

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There’s some of us so disinterested in gay matters and tittle tattle, and the blog’s continual focus theron that ,like Deaf Guy, we’re weaning ourselves away from it.

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10:45. It’s almost no news anymore because most of them are gay & everyone knows it now at this stage. The story the past few days about Ger Fitzgerald was far more interesting with all its different elements. Hoping that he & his Bishop does right by the Ladies in Killaloe. The straight ones are hiding behind the bent ones in more ways than one in the RCC 🤣🤣🤣

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What a horrible way to die meeting someone on an app and end up castrated and more. Something you would associate with Isis not so long ago. Horrendous.

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Yes, horrible deaths indeed.
What happened here reminds me of the murder of Alex Davies in England not many years ago.
Alex was only 18 years old and chatted with a 20-year-old on Grindr. The two eventually arranged to meet, but at a secluded spot on the insistence of the older man: he had told Alex that he wasn’t ‘out’ and didn’t, therefore, want to meet in a public space. Poor Alex agreed. When he got there, the older man frenziedly stabbed Alex 128 times. This, incredibly, did not kill Alex: he died by asphyxiation when his limp body was dragged through deep mud and then concealed under some wood.
Fortunately, the area was under CCTV surveillance, which was unknown to the murderer. He was eventually arrested, and convicted of his crime.
I have told this horrendous account for a reason. I am appealing to gay men to avoid so-called ‘dating apps’. The risks are just too high.

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1:50 pm Reading your comment anyone would think women had stopped getting raped….
Jesus, what a stupid position to take.

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Clergy do get accustomed to only being a gay environment. It’s so difficult for the poor dears to reacclimatise.

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11:26am Too busy FAKING IT on altars for Easter. Gotta keep dat shiw on da road I know!! 🤣

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3.17: Pat, I didn’t intend an insult with using the word ‘snappy’. I think sometimes it’s the best riposte to MMM as he does not respect your professed Christian faith not that of others. He returns iften to his hobby horse. Rather strange he does so – does he still have vestiges of a religious faith? Surely, MMM should know that some of the greatest philosophers, artists and scientists professed a Christian belief. MMM has honed his atheism down to one postulation: his inability and that of professed Christians to provide him with verifiable proof of the existence of God. Often the greatest mysteries remain indescribable or provable. When I stroll along a river bank in the quiet of an evening and have a sudden transformative moment when I am drawn to something transcendent – beauty – I ask, how can this be and if I ascribe my experience to a deity, that’s my truth, my faith, my experience. I don’t need science to validate my deeper, spiritual or religious experiences. May I refer MMM to Jordan Petersen, the Canadian philosopher and psychologist who argues very brillianty his journey from atheism or non belief to a deep belief in God. A Mhicilin, tar suas don sleibhte. (Come down from the mts…).

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Anon@ 4:26.
Oh I’m well down from the mountains of incomprehensible inconsistencies of religious beliefs.
Anon @ 3:10 above refers to just some of them. And they’re in every aspect of religious belief, …..but “there’s none so blind as………”
MMM

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Er, the bishop banging on about not admitting homosexuals will almost certainly be a homosexual – money on that – you know it’s like Wilde said – a man who moralises is a hypocrite.

Bishops delight in ordaining homosexuals – Elsie and Stock and Longley do it all day long and don’t bat an eyelid.

The RC clerical caste are predominantly gay and a high level percentage aren’t just practising Catholics their practising homosexuals.

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5.55: MMM: isn’t it interesting that you should spend so much precious time in the older years of your life pondering on the professed religious faith of other people. It’s fascinating that you should do so. Soon you’ll have your “kairos” moment when the Beatific Vision – of which you’re aware – will be so magnificent that you’ll beg mercy from the God you’ve rejected…If you have ears, listen…

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Those of us who believe in God cannot presume how God will interact with MMM

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By Post Author

Yes 8:22, being much older one has time to reflect on life, whether it really has any of the alleged “meaning” proposed by religious beliefs. I came to consider the sheer ridiculous nature of my childhood RC tribal beliefs, then of the existence of deities in general. Over the past 30-40 years the more I’ve reflected, and read insights of much greater ability than mine, the more I see the foolishness of religion: other than that it provides a panacea and salve, for it has no foundation in truth and reality. It is the duplicitous nature of religion I find distasteful.
And I haven’t rejected “God”. How can I? I see no evidence to suggest that he, she, or it exists in any shape or form. So spare me your “You’ll be soreeey” warnings.
MMM

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9.57
‘relgion…has no foundation in truth and reality’? How do you know? Do you know? Or do you pass off presumption (which, actually, is your true position) as objective truth?
Not so much intellectual rigour here as intellectual sleight of hand.

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@11:06. C’mon then, show me the “truth and reality” of YOUR religion. (Not your RELGION!) And be specific please…………….without reference to that much disputed bible reference manual, personal conviction and belief, or the blind aspirational wishful thinking of “faith”.
I’ve made this same challenge here before several times. Responses are…………
MMM

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12.26
There’d be no point, because no matter the quality of such evidence, you’d rationalise it away.
Lack of evidence isn’t the problem :it’s your attitude. You’re a sneering scoffer. You are your own worst enemy.
This type of person was around in Jesus’ time, too: ‘He casts out demons by the Prince of Demons’. No matter what Jesus did, these detractors always had a smart answer to hand. Or so they thought.
I’ll wager your hubris spills into other areas of your life, too: you always know more and best.
Like Richard Dawkins, you’ll spend eternity trying to convince God that he doesn’t exist, if only to avoid admitting to yourselves (everyone else will know) that you were wrong all along.
Keep observing those biblical precepts you expressed admiration for. You know, about love of neighbour, and all that. What you won’t admit, even to yourself, is that this, subconsciously, is insurance against the possibility, from your point of view, that you might be wrong after all, and that God really does exist. And that you had better have something to show him rather than empty hands when it comes your turn to drop off this ‘mortal coil’.
I mean, you wouldn’t want to be trying to persuade the Other Fella that HE doesn’t exist, would you? For he might just try harder than usual to convince you that he does. 👿

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Anon@ 1.48. Is this the best you can do? Really?
Your comment is simply another diversionary ad hominem retort of indignation.
Surely you can do better?……… at least by making an attempt of some proof rather than your feeble effort at deflection.
MMM

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3.35

This is my last comment on the subject, MMM, since there is no point in chasing our tails any further. I shall leave the last word to you, if you want it.

As I said, the issue here really isn’t lack of either evidence or its quality: it’s your attitude to any that might be offered to you. But you can’t or won’t accept the fact.

When Jesus remained silent on foot of Pilate’s question, ‘what is truth?’, Jesus wasn’t deflecting, or being rude, or being stupid for squandering an opportunity to evangelise a Roman governor: he was being realistic. Pilate wasn’t ready either to understand or accept whatever reply Jesus might have made.

There is more than psychology here: there is lack of spiritual preparedness, and, therefore, of spiritual intelligence. Pilate lacked both too much for Jesus to make any worthwhile reply. And sadly, so, currently, do you.

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Àha@3:50! The heart of the matter: nothing to do with validating religious beliefs, …..it’s my attitude that matters!
Well at least there’s consistency in the customary ad hominem focus when I ask for proof, any proof, which validates religious beliefs: just like all the others.
I was going to count up, and comment on the number of times you referred to me in your ad hominem comment, saying “your attitude; you can’t or won’t” etc etc, but decided there’s no point, nor in continuing with you.
Have a nice Easter.
MMM

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Interesting comment by Archbishop Martin Newry today about the future of Dromore Diocese. I think he’s had enough of being their minder

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@12.24pm Equally Dromore has had enough of its useless minder and his sidekick. They should get their own house in order and red up the mess in their own front garden before trying to do it elsewhere. Pompous authoritarian twits.

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“I am conscious today that it is now three years since Pope Francis asked me to oversee the diocese of Dromore as apostolic administrator. It has been a joy for me to work with you during this time and to discover the deep sense of faith in the people, religious and priests of this historic diocese. It’s time now to start thinking about the future of the diocese of Dromore. And today I wish to invite all the people of the diocese to join me in reflecting about the needs of this diocese and how we can best serve the future of the Catholic faith in these parts.

The first fruits of the recent synodal conversations will certainly help us in preparing options for the future of the diocese. It is important for us to consider if the diocese of Dromore will be best able to continue to journey as a distinct diocese in its own right, or if the needs of the faith will be better served by our linking with a neighbouring diocese or dioceses in the coming years.

I invite you to join me in considering how we should best move forward. Please pray that the Lord will walk with us on the journey as we consider the future of the diocese of Dromore together. May the word of God inspire our reflection and may the Holy Spirit give us all the gifts we need of wisdom, understanding, knowledge and right judgement.”

https://www.catholicbishops.ie/2022/04/14/homily-of-archbishop-eamon-martin-for-chrism-mass-2022-in-the-diocese-of-dromore/

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Surely it’s incorrect to refer to a bishop yet to be installed in his diocese as ‘bishop elect’?
It implies he’s been elected!

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Yes. Bishop-elect is correct when there is an election, as in the Church of Ireland. Bishop designate is the appropriate term in this case.

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Pat I’m howling at the comments today. I can’t decide which I think are funnier. Every time I look at the gay priests trying to reconcile their existence with the actual church teaching, I change my mind and think it’s the ones who think holy week is the perfect time to try to start up the hell insurance racket again. 😂

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He was born in Sligo so not a refugee. Ireland is now facing the harsh reality like the UK of brutal homegrown Islamic fundamentalism. Someone said earlier it reminded him of what Isis have done in the past. Yes, Sligo today so where next in this Island? Soft defenceless targets and victims. Ireland is importing this problem in recent years.

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It is clear that the Sligo murders involved two promiscuous men who used an app for casual gay sex. Sadly, they have paid a heavy price because of their lifestyles and actions. Men who engage in such risky gay promiscuity must accept the danger that this involves and the terrible hurt to those they leave behind. These men are not the first and they will not be the last using such apps to meet total anonymous strangers for casual sex. Listen all who have ears, it’s a subject deserving of much debate and a wake up call to the so called modern progressive Ireland. We have to accept the consequences of our actions and to a certain extent our stupidity and recklessness.

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7.56
That is a disgraceful comment in its homophobia and finger-pointing moral superiority. It’s like saying victims of tape are asking for what they get. It’s shocking Pat allowed this drivel. I suggest he or she put their name to this screed if they believe what they have written.

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7.56 Your comment in my opinion amounts to an offence in law and needs scrutiny. Apart from the legality of it, you have moral depravity in your personage. I posit: what do you get up to when no one is observing ( I do not posit that lightly)? Shame on you.

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7.56

I read your comment, twice, before composing this reply, and only after regaining my composure.

I’d like to think your comment tongue-in-cheek; I really would. In very poor taste, granted, but tongue-in-cheek neverthelss. Of course, I know it isn’t.

Are you of Middle-Eastern descent, too? Like the murder suspect? You didn’t mention him even once. Telling, that.

People, like you, who blame victims for the terrible things that others do to them…I think I’d better stop here: I lost my composure again.

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7.56: Pat, this is a despicable comment. It is as depraved as the brutality inflicted on these men. Sir at 7.56, it’s attitudes like yours that contributed to the vicious murder of these two men. When you hold such absolutist, poisonous, hate inciting views as you do, then YOU are complicit in the evil displayed. You ought to be named for the homophobuc racist you are. Yes, we need a conversation about gay men and women, not about how to hate them or classify them as evil, but a conversation which acknowledges their human dignity. You may not approve of such people, but your comment is morally evil and reprehensible. I’m saddened that so soon after their horrendous deaths that Pat prints this comment: evil personified.

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I know people are turning against @7.56pm and I have read the contribution several times. It does raise important questions and issues though that ought to be discussed and addressed, however unpleasant it may seem. Difficult topics are painful to discuss.

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10.19
What issues? Would this include blaming the Sligo victims for the atrocious crimes committed against them? Because this is the thrust of that outrageous post.
Let’s be clear: no one, not even you or the poster at 7.56, deserves to be murdered, let alone so barbarically and horrifically, just because of a choice to have casual sex with someone met online. Can you grasp this? Such sex is not a capital offence; it isn’t even illegal.
This is the ONLY issue here: that no one deserves death for such a consensual arrangement.
Any attempt to shift attention from the Sligo killer to his victims immediately begins to imply reduced responsibility and culpability for crimes the killer chose to commit. This would be morally outrageous, but it is what is implied at 7.56 and, indeed, somewhat in your own post.
The subtext of the post particularly at 7.56 is clear: those men in Sligo brought this savage cruelty on themselves. They deserved it! Because they were dirty queers!
Your post comes perilously close to suggesting the same.

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10.19
The far more important questions raised by 7.56 and repeated by your own disgraceful comment is the lack of proportion between your respective concerns for the consentual actions of the victims and your ignoring of the criminal actions of the perpetrator. Myopic and moralising obsession with the sexual lives of others do not show both of you, or, if you are the source of both comments, you, in a favourable light.

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Islam playing catch-up with Christian barbarity. The leaders of both despite the chronological disparity are despicable. To be human is blessed in all its myriad benevolent forms.

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He looks as gay as a goose Pat….
The silly prat can’t hide it.
Imagine drawing authority from Ratzingers ramblings…..and him the biggest flaming queen whoever put on red shoes 👠 🤣 you couldn’t make it up.

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Ukraine like Russia has little tolerable for the rights of gay men and women…. A direct link to Religion. Despicable.

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If only they were like tolerant states such as Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan and Palestine.

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Kevin Dorian and his ilk should offer their resignations along with homophobic Gardai for their oral contribution to Hate Crime. Bill Mulvihill

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It’ll be a long time before I forget the comment of the Ardee Seargent on my shoes at an event in Collon to present to Sean Brady a Mattock Rangers Jersey….. oh yes those Gardai and their homophobla…. So fucking Roman Catholic…. My shoes had deer skin… well the Shit knew!!!!!

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There are really wonderful men who are priests. I spoke with one of them today; his life is an inspiration to me; a really good human being; I phoned him deliberately today because his wisdom and my life collide. Or vice versa. Pity the CEO s ruin it with their careers and ambitions. Every time I talk with this man of many years, I come away enhanced.

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Do ye remember Nulty on RTE being challenged. He stated in response; “ We have rules.” The lying duplicitous hypocrite. Did him no good anyway.

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I liked Frank, the night watchman in Maynooth. He had plenty of great yarns, including one involving the Junior Infirmary. RIP.

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Good riddance to frank as he was never that frank with the truth. Turned a blind eye to the gay activity goings on at night but could soon forget them if you crossed his palm with a few notes. Frank was a spy and reported everything unless you had bought him or slipped him a bottle of Powers.

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8.32 He is not sitting in Kildare with a pointy hat because he is a caring person. As Eileen said to me on hearing of the appointment ; that was on the cards for a long time!! Enough said.

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For all you lay men and women out there, the Carole’s and Yvonne’s of the mad world, NO priest will ever be able to satisfy all of your needs. Cut your ties and be free.

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8.34 Since you bring Drogheda up: there is a Canadian citizen who could tell quite a bit about the said Nulty in relation to the school he insisted on bulldozing through ( with success but without ethics). That woman ( now in Canada I believe) has an iconic story of their ways. Brutal.

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Sligo is a chilling warning to all those who use so-called dating apps, such as Grindr. It’s very dangerous.

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Kevin Doran needs to apologise for his comments quite some time ago on gay people like myself ( Is he ?). He and leaders like him in Creed and politics are not without culpability when crimes are committed against innocent parties. Any public personage who does not embrace the variance of benevolent human nature but promotes hatred of difference and divergence in a western democracy needs to be prosecuted by the rigour of the Law. An end to the rights of violent religion/creed. Islam, Christian or Fundamentalist Protestantism to start with. Wake up Elected Representatives and pass it into Law.

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8.55 I am still fascinated that in the Republic of Ireland it is still a issue; I am grateful for your comment and honesty: I do hold that the appearance of progress is illusory; I also hold that the heterosexual community are a lot more promiscuous than the like of me: I am gone happily from the priesthood of the RCC but in their terminology : chaste: what a shame!!! Religion and Credal belief do immeasurable harm. There is a cohort in An Garda Siochana making headway beyond societal progress and I am not one to pay them idle compliment, as I left the courts, I shall never forget the kindness of an officer who clearly understood!!! Tragedy is I do not know his name.

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We read Mark 16 on the 44th day of Lent. Our Bible readings from Ash Wednesday to this Easter Triduum is complete.
Jesus washed the feet of the man who would deny him, the man who would betray and the men who would abandon him. Are there people whose feet we would not wash?
The Novena for Divine Mercy starts tomorrow. There is no rest for the wicked.

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But Seamus, the washing of the feet does not appear in Chapter 16 of Mark, or in any chapter of Mark.
The Divine Mercy is a Polish devotion that doesn’t travel well.

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8.35
Wojtyła’s so-called theology of the body and the Polish nun’s spirituality are cut from the same cloth and would be better not to be exported.

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I am enjoying my glass of wine, having left all the nonsense of Holy Week behind. To think I even used to believe in all that nonsense and would enter into the drama of it. I head to the West End these days for drama.

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Any person, priest of prelate of the Roman Catholic Church encouraging hatred of a homosexual person in their teaching of disorder requires the prosecution of the Law of our Republic in the dissemination of their illegal teachings: they are in conflagration of the Laws of our Republic.

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